7973881
And boom! You once again fall into a figurative trap that not only exposes your BS lies and such, but also exposes you for the pathetic and cowardly hypocrite you really are.

I absolutely knew you weren't going to answer that question about Martin Luther King Jr. truthfully, but just do what you've been doing this whole damn time, try to make a bunch of truly pathetically weak excuses to try to justify the "progressive" BS you clowns like to force onto others.

While I do plan ahead, at this point, I feel like I could figuratively dig a pit ahead of where you're walking and not even try to cover it, as well as putting a bunch of signs that says "pit ahead", and you'd still just walk right into it.

7973905
And boom! You sank Diokno's battleship.

But I'm sure he's going to just try to make yet another excuse to try to avoid admitting he was wrong about anything.

Because these "progressive" types are always so unjustifiably full of themselves that they really think they can never be wrong about anything.

7973905
Fair point, still I roll my eyes when the post uses the term "the wokes", reminds me of that dumb ass tier list I saw of calling Arch a good "anti-woke" channel

7974084
Much like how people roll their eyes when people say and advocate for “female representation” in Space Marines and Adeptus Custodes. Bruh, representation? More like:

Ironic from the people saying objectifying women is wrong. But it is okay in situations like this. Oh fun fact, the most people I’ve seen so far who disapproved of the Femstodes, have been women of the hobby (and sadly get harassed by people who claims to be champion of women). But most who approve of the Femstodes, have been men… of the male feminist and sex pest variety.

Yeah starting to believe the whole representation schtick was never about representation, it’s nothing more than either narcissists to self-insert themselves into stories, or porn addicts trying to shove their fetish down peoples throat until it’s accepted. Remember that happened last time with a New Vegas mod? You know the one.

7974090
I've seen a few ladies be ambivalent or accepting of the whole idea....granted some of them ARE into muscular ladies, so....one argument noted that becoming a Custodes would remove any defects and insufficiences, regardless of gender, and all Custodes would be equal in all but battle experience. Especially as IIRC, except in some occasions, not every Custodian fought in every battle

7974064
Wow dude, can you NOT be a dick like, for once? And its not the same thing. One was admittedly not a historical piece, about a relative footnote in history, and more a drama piece about her expierence and those like her, while the other would be replacing a man who fought for racial equality for minorities, with someone of the then majority.

7973905
Still, I have heard for years that there were female Astartes back in the Rogue Trader and 1st Edition Days, and its to me weird that fans will accept some retcons, and despise others.

7973391
Also, one thing, Phantom of the Opera, one of the most famous actors who played the Phantom on Broadway, Ramin Karimloo, is a British man of Persian descent, and yet he plays a native Frenchman, and no one batted an eye. Plus, I've recorded productions of Hamilton where he wasn't portrayed by a black man, by but a number of people. Or, look at say, non European productions of Les Mis.

7974201
You may have a point. Except…

Another Twitter post debunking that

"Oh yeah well heres some Rogue trader FEMALE SPACE MARINES! HA TAKE THAT CHUD!"

Status: Complete Misinformation

Now this is a popular tactic by woke types as pictured in 1st shot of the person in question attempt to debunk "Only men can be space marines".

However there are problems with this tactic.

For a start they were never presented as Space Marines but rather more as an early form of sisters.

You can see this with the shoulder pads matching the later releases of sisters in pictures 2 & 3.

Then you can also see on the models themselves the words Sister written at the base of the miniatures in picture 4.

Also anything from the Rogue trader era of Warhammer 40K which is often referred to as 1st edition is no longer considered part of Warhammer official cannon lore.

However some things have carried over a lot of it was scrapped for essentially the rebooted launch in 2nd edition.

7974208
Fair, even if the usage of the term woke makes my eyes roll with how much of a dogwhistle that word is nowadays. But TBF, you could also see them as being Sisters in the way the Astartes call themselves Brothers. Plus let's face it, Rogue Trader and 1st were....unique, period.

7974200
Oh, I'm not a dick because I point out things you don't like being true, I'm just being honest and not caving to you and "progressive" BS.

And they are the same thing you cowardly little hypocrite!

You're literally trying to say "It's ok for the groups I like to do this or that, but not for others to do those very same things" and you know it. It's the classic "rules for thee but not for me" crap.

And like it or not Diokno, if it's ok for black people to play white historical figures, then it's ok for white or otherwise people to play black historical figures, and any other way for that matter.

End. Of. Story.

To try to say otherwise is to be nothing but a racist hypocrite, and you know it.

Neither I nor facts care about your feelings Dikno

7974090
That's actually a great point dude.

I know it's kind of been said before, but these "progressive" types don't really care any of the settings and such they try to take over, they just want to try to make everyone pay attention to them, and like you pointed out with that great image, try to justify their weird fetishes and such.

If any of them could just put all their BS aside, most of us would be more than ready to welcome them as fans of a setting or whatever you want to call them.

I'm just honestly tired of hearing all those hypocrites try to cry victim when anyone gives the slightest bit of pushback when they demand that everyone agree with their views and pay attention to them.

7974237
I mean, what's wrong with agreeing that trans, bi, disabled, or any minorities have representation? I mean yes, in some settings, like Kingdom Come Deliverance, it makes sense that a majority of the people there are white, but in the second game at least, they have said it'll be more diverse, which IMO, makes sense. In the first game, you mostly roamed about in relatively small towns and villages. While yes, people traveled, most wouldn't say, travel to a whole ass different nation unless they were some envoy or another. Like, Pentiment, it had a Romani and an Ethiopian. But still, some of us DO care about the settings. We're not trying to "take it over", but you know, help the community expand? Like here's the thing man, a dedicated fanbase is GOOD, but it alone can't keep a franchise afloat forever, especially as many begin to age out. Like there was a brief reference to a character transitioning, and some people, like Arch and his band of fellow assholes, are screaming about "Wokehammer" despite it in universe not being a big deal

7974216
Well then, maybe let's start using using leftoids or lefties. Don't like that? Maybe, faux-progressive neo-liberals? BlackRock Cultists? Rainbow Alphabet Soup Gestapo? Support the Current Thing Drones? Or return using Social Justice Warriors or start using Social Justice Narcissists?

Don't like any of them? Well, woke it is then.

7974274

We're not trying to "take it over", but you know, help the community expand?

Via Twitter post

"No one is going to take your hobby toy's away or Force you out MAN BABIES!"

Status: Blatant Lies

You seen it time and time again in more than just one Community.

As Conflict is built in humanity some people just can't let people have a fun time.

Many do it for different reasons usually for internet clout (Likes, retweets, followers and even some cases money or what ever other thing they are shilling out)

Some do it for an ideology/political movement they conform to.

And some just likes a power trip of agitating a mob.

& Some people are just out to bully you into submission and make you feel alone and out numbered.

These people will do anything to annoy you off the platform and to get you to stop talking or conform to their way of thinking.

They will typically try to make you out to be a horrible person who must be removed from the community while presenting themselves or their ideology as a completely clean or Justified Saint.

Do not let these Clowns Bully you.

Use Block/Mute are options if you don't want to see them.

Or if its really bad report them.

And Never stop thinking & speaking for yourself.

And you do know going mainstream does not always, end well?

Or perhaps maybe you need to start asking yourself, why more and more fans becoming more tolerant towards the idea of gatekeeping fandom tourists (Or colonizers)? Maybe we've seen this over and over with other fandoms and franchises? Or perhaps fans saw the toxic activism (from the progressives) around the Hogwarts Legacy shitshow and they don't want that in their hobby?

7974274
Answer the damn question Diokno. And do so honestly.

If black people can play historical figures who were white, then it's ok for white or people with other skin color to play historical figures who were black right?

I mean, if you "progressive" types really are really tolerant and open minded, then it should be more than fair for everyone to play any historical character regardless of skin color right?

Because if it's not ok, that would be you trying to have double standards, you know, the classic "rules for thee but not for me" thing.

You don't want to be a hypocrite do you Diokno?

7974274
I want you to firstly answer the question, but I also have more to say.

But that is what you guys are trying to do. As in take over stuff and change it to suit your oh so "progressive" views.

You clowns try to act that because there were a few homosexuals here and there through history that there were actually millions and millions of them everywhere. As well as try to lie and act as if the whole trans thing was ancient, when in reality, it's actually super recent, relatively speaking.

You clowns constantly try to claim that you're against racism and bigotry, all while trying to constantly keep race and such an issue, which shows how racist and bigoted you guys really are.

And while I don't agree with every opinion Arch has, I will say that he's far more of a respectable than you, because he has never caved to you guys and all your "progressive" BS. And I'm sure all the stuff you guys say about him is also a bunch of BS. Because I know that the mere thought of anyone standing their ground against you guys enrages you to no end.

7974289
He's a bigot at times, like using the R-word, which is yah know, a slur against the mentally disabled. Still, we're not saying there were millions everywhere, but just that being gay was a thing LONG before it was public, because people often suppressed it, due in part to social pressure. I mean, a lot of gay men, even within living memory, had "beards", IE they would marry women to keep up the prospect of being straight, because otherwise they would often be jailed or worse, or at the least socially shunned for being a "deviant" I mean, look at Boys Beware. And OK, it isn't OK for white people to play black people, but again, you are taking a very few examples, its not some kind of norm now.

And standing our ground? Guy is an asshole and a bigot. Like, he did a whole vid on a recent mention of transitioning in 40K. Like, for fuck's sake, genetic science is one of the few things the 40K HASN'T slid backwards on. You can bet that, at the least the rich, can near easily transition, cause people can transition now, with our 21st century tech. It was one small mention, but people like Arch blow it out of proportion. It was just a pilot mentioning offhand he knew someone who took on this famous person's name when they transitioned, that was all.

7974389
Answer the damn question Diokno!

And I'm going to keep pushing that until you answer it honestly.

But I guess I'll just answer for you, since you're too cowardly to do so.

If it's 100% ok for black people can play historical figures that were in fact white, then it's 100% ok white people to play historical figures who were black, or really anyone of any skin color to any historical figures across the board.

And whether you admit it or not Diokno, if you claim otherwise, then it does in fact expose you for being the racist hypocrite you really are.

7974389
And well, seeing as how I have some mental disabilities of my own and I'm ok with with people using the R word to describe people who are incredibly stupid, it's not really an issue that you try to say it is.

Because there's in fact a difference between someone telling one of his friends "Dude, you're retarded" when he does something stupid and actually making fun of people with real mental disabilities.

But seeing as how it's you guys who literally call anyone and everyone who doesn't bow down to you and all you "progressive" bullshit bigots, nazis, racists, or whatever else you clowns can barely manage to think of, you doing it again doesn't really mean much, other than exposing you guys for the complete hypocrites you are.

But no no, it's you guys who are the tolerant ones right?

You clowns can't handle diversity of thought, which is something that matters far more and any of the crap you try to push.

Again, quit trying to push the lie that because a few homosexuals existed back in history that that means there were magically millions upon millions of them back then, and also quit trying to push the lie that the whole trans thing isn't a recent thing, because we all know it is, so get over it.

7974389
But guess what Diokno?

All you so called "progressive" types are nothing but a bunch of hypocrites to all you supposedly "stand for".

You're the ones who claim to be tolerant, open minded, and accept everyone, but then have the nerve to demand that everyone else has to blindly agree with you guys, and anyone that doesn't is just pure evil and you guys have the right to attack them and otherwise try to ruin their lives.

And there's also how it's you guys who constantly try to keep things like race, sexuality, and all that other "progressive" crap at the forefront, just to try to keep it all relevant.

But no no, it's everyone else who are the bigots, racists, nazis, and so on right?

What a freaking joke.

7974438
Bruh, is it so to to wrong ry and get people to try and accept lesbians, gays, non binaries and the like are normal and shouldnt be discriminated against? Also, homosexuality is something natural in animals, which includes humans. Non straight people have existed for millenia, and many likely were closeted or kept it under wraps. Same with lesbians and beint bi

But how about this, we agree to disagree? Clearly we arent going to change eachother's minds, and all this is doing is flooding the chat. How about we cordially accept we dont agree, and move on?

7974453
And to quote a certain doctor.

How about NOOO!

Jokes aside, here come yet more pathetic excuses that expose you for the cowardly hypocrite you are.

But no, you're just trying to convince yourself that if you say a lie enough times, that it will magically become true.

You guys are trying to say that right is wrong and wrong is right. Just to try to convince yourselves that it's everyone else who's the problem, when in reality, it's very obvious that you're really the ones with the problems.

And the fact you're trying to say that homosexuality is natural in animals is just plain stupid to say the least. Mainly because animals all run on some form of instinct, such as mating seasons and all, and they aren't really capable of higher thought processes. Therefore, a male dog humping another male dog or a human's leg is not the same thing as two human men or womenchoosing to do the same thing.

Because like it or not Diokno, we humans were designed to be different from the animals. Because I don't seen nor heard of any space stations and such out there that are crewed by Gorillas or some other type of animal.

But again, it's incredibly obvious that people like you just want to try to justify anything you desire to do, just because you want to be able to get away with this, that, or whatever without any consequences.

7974453
Here's a funny little fact that will no doubt enrage you, mainly from the fact that you know it's true.

If homosexuality and all that stuff was truly normal and such, then no one would care, no one would even bat on eyelash at any of it.

But people do care, and you guys know why. But yet again, you just want to convince yourselves with pretty little lies that tell you guys you're all good people and that it's everyone else who's the problem and they're all evil, but never you.

7974547
Its been proven since the 1920's via the works of Magnus Hirschfield that it was natural, like say, giraffes for instance. Plus, a lot of animals are more intelligent than we give them for. Also, people care because of social norms. Because of the fact that males and females have to fuck to have kids, which yes, is true. But there are also straight couples that can't, or don't have kids. Also we aren't trying to "justify" getting away with anything, we want people to just be accepted for loving who they want to, provided of course that person is of legal age.

7974573

Really Diokno?

The best thing you could up with was from back in the 20s?

And just when I thought you couldn't make me laugh anymore. Thanks for being such an effectively funny clown Diokno.

But I do love how you only mention the whole biology thing because can't truly deny it exists without looking quite stupid. I can see it now

You: *through clenched teeth* "Also, people care because of social norms. Because of the fact that males and females have to fuck to have kids, which yes, is true."

I can especially see you saying, or in this case, typing the "which yes, is true" part while shaking with rage and wanting to break something, or rather having the desire to punch me in the face if you could.

And yes, social norms are a thing for a freaking good reason genius.

And don't try to lie and say that just because some biological men and women are unable to have kids that it somehow means that homosexuality or any of that crap is magically a natural part of simply being human. It's just a freak chance of life really.

Now, I have ADHD and some slight Asperger's Syndrome, that doesn't mean the babies that were near me in the hospital also had those ailments, nor did I happen to have anything that any of them may have had that I didn't. It was all just a freak chance of life.

But then again, you guys want to blame literally everyone else for your problems, except yourselves of course.

7974573
But I also find it hilarious that you're trying to now mention all that "we just want to love who we want" and such things, just to attempt to try to make you guys not look quite as bad.

And I just wanted to share these couple of videos just to further prove the point of how you guys are nothing but hypocrites to supposedly being "tolerant" and "accepting".

And while they're a couple years old, they still show how oh so tolerant and caring you "progressive" types really are.

Video 1

Video 2

7974608
Don't forget about Hogwarts Legacy.

Post to "The Hogwarts Legacy Saga: You're All Frauds"
Post to "So... About this Pikamee Situation..."
Post to "Never let the frauds who bullied and harassed people over a Harry Potter video game forget what they have done"

7974637
Oh yeah, I forgot about all that laughable whining and tantrums that all the "progressive" types did over that game.

I won't get too in to all of it, but I do find it pretty funny how many of the groups that think of themselves as "progressive" and all are actually very clearly ready to stab each other in the back over certain things.

And are those links to YouTube videos?

I'm just always kind of wary of taking links, that's all.

7974682
Those are links to my user page blog posts I made around the situation.

7974684
Oh, ok.

Maybe I'll try to remember to check them out tomorrow.

7974606 Listen, love is not entirely a choice, its in part wired into you based on who you find attractive. You can't "become" gay. Also, Antifa, like all groups, has extremists and non extremists. Plus, fuck Trump and the Proud Boys. Also yes, while Hogwarts Legacy got overblown and people who bought it likely bought it out of a love for the franchise....there is the fact it has some sus stuff, granted the Goblins I've always been on the fence on. On one hand, one can see how they're similar to stereotypes of Jews, on the other, well, Goblins have always been fairly unpleasant looking. Meanwhile the Sirona bit....I can see why having the name SIRona for a transfemale can be seen as iffy, it could have been MUCH worse

7974606
Also, his research paved the way to people studying why people may not be hetero, or if they're trans, nonbinary, and the like, and was part of the reason that led to LGBTQ people fighting for their rights for DECADES, despite suffering jail at the least. Like, people like Alan Turing were forcefully chemically castrated just for being gay. There's a REASON a lot of people weren't open about it, this belief that they're all sexual deviants who wanna fuck kids

7974723
*sigh*
Quit trying to be such a manipulative coward Diokno. Because you suck at it. And anyone with half a brain could see right through your crap.

But of course, you show your true colors once again. Because you've drank too much of the "progressive" Kool-Aid and you really believe all the bullshit.

And while I don't really like Trump, I will say that the only reason blind sheep like you hate him and people like the Proud Boys is because they didn't just bow down to all you hypocrites and all your bullshit. Though it was more Trump not playing the Democrats' games and the Proud Boys standing up to your pathetic Antifa goons.

Well, that and the fact that you guys all blindly bought into what the incredibly biased morons in the mainstream media told you think, and never questioned any of it.

But what's funniest about your pathetic attempts to justify all that crap is that you are constantly showing you have double stands, because you're always trying to make exceptions and excuses for the "progressive" groups.

You're pretty much trying to all but say it's ok for alphabet people or black people or whoever else to do this or that. And honestly, at this point, I wouldn't be surprised if you all but said it was ok for anyone from your "protected" groups to commit murder, especially against groups you hypocrites hate and resent.

7974723
And you're wrong Diokno, yet again.

You try to say "you can't become gay" and all that bullshit, but that once again exposes your double standards.

Because you're trying to blatantly leave out major things like how little kids never really come out as homosexual or any of that stuff, unless they're pressured to do by people around them. And don't try to pass it off as if "it has to do with puberty" or whatever excuse you can barely come up with, because we all know it's bullshit.

But what sickens me most is the fact that people like you will pretty much try to complete support anyone who tries to obviously pressure little kids to be this or that, all while claiming that any of it's "natural" in any way, and then call those people "stunning and brave" for it.

But then again, you guys have no real sense of right and wrong, as you'll just choose to believe whatever makes you guys feel good about yourselves.

7974726
Quit trying to be such a liar Diokno, and try to act as if it's still the 30s or 40s or whatever.

I'm getting really sick of people like you trying to outright lie and pretend that there's just hordes of KKK and Nazis roaming around the US and that alphabet, black people, and so on are all being round up and killed in the tens of thousands, when anyone with half a brain could see that that's just not the case.

I'm so sick of all you "progressive" hypocrites constantly crying victim and that you're "oppressed" in some way, when in reality, you spoiled brats have it incredibly easy compared your parents and grandparents.

One such example of this is how the black people who stupidly support BLM don't appreciate how comparably good they've got it and that many of them choose to not "try in life", for lack of a better term.

What I mean is that there are quite a lot of examples of black men and women out there have become successful business owners and such, and many of the older ones among them actually had to deal with actual racism and such when the started out, yet they didn't give up and kept at it.

And the best part is that many of the most long lived famous restaurants I've seen or heard about over the years, in the South no less, are owned black people and or their children and family, or even some of the now older original owners.

But what I'm talking about is the black people who support BLM, who clearly hate the successful black folks, who went out and made something of themselves and didn't just sit around and stew in resentment. And they hate the successful black people because they want what they have but don't want to actually have to work hard for it.

And while that's not restricted to black people, as stupidity knows no color or either of the two genders, they're just a prime example of the selfishness all you "progressive" types have.

7974768
Um. most people tend to come out as gay, or trans, or the like, in their teens or early 20's. Plus, you know, people have come out for decades even before modern media had a lot of openly gay characters that weren't the butt of a joke or the like. Also, BLM started out as a way to protest against the unlawful deaths of people like Oscar Grant, Treyvon Martin and the like. The lootings and the like aren't justified, it never is regardless of race. But it started out calling for justice, because the police system, even from cops I've met, is very flawed, such as The Blue Wall, IE the pressure for cops to side with other cops, no matter what. But we clearly aren't going to change each other's opinion, so I'm bowing out. Have a nice life.

7974810
Oh sure they do Diokno. That's why they're trying to pressure little kids to come out as this or that so early now, as well as really everyone else to agree with them right?

But I love how all you are capable of doing at this point is to do nothing but making excuse after excuse for any of these groups. It's truly laughable to say the least.

You just don't want to admit that the alphabet people aren't really the victims you claim they are anymore.

7974810
Plus, BLM is also nothing but a bunch of lying hypocrites. Mainly because they're incredibly selective about what they riot and loot over, which it turns out is mostly over some dumbass choosing to go and break the law and then fight with cops, and then they often get shot by said cops, and somehow it's the cops' fault for his bad choices.

And despite the lies you choose to try to believe Diokno, the vast majority of these "police brutality" cases that make the news and those BLM hypocrites riot and loot over have been criminals who chose to break the law and then fight with or shoot at cops, and then they died because of their stupid life choices.

But of course, all the criminal's family and even people who didn't know the moron will say stuff like "He was always such a good boy/man who would never hurt a fly! And he was just on his way to the local church or homeless shelter to help feed those in need" or some other made up sob story, while in reality the now dead guy was really a chose to drop out of school or some other stupid choice in life, like running with the gangs and such.

And guess what Diokno? Police forces aren't just a white boy club anymore, there are plenty of black, hispanic, and other officers now, but of course, you hypocrites will only try to say it was was always a white man who done it.

7974810
I mean, I've literally seen a lot of videos of black people calling out BLM as being complete and total hypocrites. And here are some of them.

Video 1

Video 2
At least from 3:43 onward.

Video 3
The part at the start is the best.

And while not a BLM getting called out video, this
Video 4
is just another example of a "younger" black man who was clearly just on his way to to the local soup kitchen and never did nothin wrong.

And actually have the balls to actually watch them Diokno.

7974845
OK, one last response. Yes,, I know its not an all white club anymore, but there is still a lot of instances of bad actors or the like in the police. I know that in some cases, the people shot aren't saints, but some of their actions can be critiqued by the common people. Anyway, I am done, goodbye

7974860

Yeah yeah, run away like the cowardly little hypocrite you are Diokno. Just like I knew you would. Just like all of you "progressive" types do when you know you've lost a debate.

But you can't actually answer any of my points honestly because you know that all the stuff you blindly believe is just bullshit.

So run back to your safe space echo chamber where you try to believe you can hide from the real world and that all your fairytale land bullshit is real.

7974872
I'm sorry I feel empathy for people and want to end bigotry. Like for fuck's sake, our police system has been heavily flawed for ages, there are still instances of bigotry against trans folk, gay folk, etc, though thankfully relatively less, and yes, racism sadly still exists in this day and age. But fine, I'll leave, kindly, have a nice life

7974910
Yeah yeah Diokno, run away like the coward we all know you are. Because yet again, all you can do is try to treat lies as if they're truth.

And you're just a cowardly hypocrite since you blatantly try to ignore the points I make, such as what I said about human decency.

Because despite how much you may want to lie about it Diokno, showing human decency does not require one to pretty much just tell lies to a few people that do in fact have problems that those things aren't problems just to make them feel better about themselves.

And neither does human decency require that people have to just give obviously lazy people whatever they want because they simply exist.

But then again, you'll just continue to be the pathetic spineless coward and hypocrite I and others have exposed to you for being.

7974910
And yet another nuke to destroy your "progressive" bullshit. This time about racism.

The fact that the US had a black man as president for 2 terms, or 8 years, basically nukes all your bullshit about racism from orbit.

And again, the majority of us don't constantly obsess over things like race, but you "progressive" types do.

Gee, I wonder why?

7974989
People made monkey jokes and memes about Obama too. Also, while not race based, there is the fact that there have been cases of police being rough when getting homeless people to move. Like the justice system is heavily biased towards the wealthy abd often those more visually appealing. But im done, have a nice life

7975103
Oh yeah, because that was literally everyone right?

And yeah yeah Diokno, that's what you always say, yet you come back every time, because your ego can't let go of the fact that you lost decisively and then ran like a pathetic coward, liar, and hypocrite.

Because all you've done is constantly run away from any point I've made because it proves that you "progressive" types are nothing but cowards, because you clowns aren't able to handle when anyone brings up facts and arguments you can't just pretend away.

You are literally trying to lie to yourself and pretending that you "progressive" types are somehow the good guys in all this.

Oh, of course you'll say the standard "there are bad guys on both sides" excuse, but will then turn around and try to defend things that anyone with half a brain would know are objectively wrong.