Random Episode Review of the Day: Return of Harmony · 4:14am Sep 12th, 2012
…No opening bit. This is #26, “Return of Harmony.” Let’s get this done with.
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TECHNICAL SPECS:
Season: 2
Episodes: 1 and 2
Written By: M. A. Larson
First Aired: September 17 and September 24, 2011
SUMMARY:
While on a field trip to the Canterlot Castle Gardens, Cheerilee shows her class the statue of a Draconequus, a creature whose bodies are made up of different parts from other creatures and represents disharmony. The Crusaders, however, get into a fight over just what it represents, and as the class leaves, the statue begins to crack…
Soon after, strange things begin to happen around Ponyville. Cotton candy clouds dispense chocolate rain, bunnies run around on elongated legs, and worst of all, the animation has been upgraded by a hundred degrees! The Mane 6 manage to keep things under control to an extent, but are soon contacted by Princess Celestia and told to come to Canterlot immediately. The six have an uneventful trip over, and find Celestia in a state of complete shock and worry. With the aid of some stained-glass windows, she tells them the tale of Discord, the draconequus Chaos God that ruled Equestria before Celestia and Luna. He made ponies suffer for eons under his chaotic reign, but was finally defeated when the sisters used the Elements of Harmony to imprison him in stone and took control of Equestria. But now that the Mane 6 are the new Bearers of the Elements, they must defeat him again. To do this, Celestia shows them the highly-secured vault where the Elements are stored…
And the box is empty.
Discord finally makes his presence known, shifting around the different windows like a snake and taunting the group with their Elements and Celestia’s uselessness. He finally gives them a chance to get the Elements back, as long as they play his “game.” He gives them a riddle about “twists and turns,” and then departs. Twilight immediately figures that this refers to the hedge maze in the gardens, and the six head down to take a look. But before they can even enter the maze, Discord takes away their wings and horns, telling them that one of the rules is that they cannot fly or use magic. And when they do step inside, walls suddenly form around each of them, isolating the party.
With the group separated, Discord works his magic, convincing each one to give up their connection to their Element. He shows Applejack a vision of the group breaking up, and tells her that it’s better to lie so they’ll be happier. He makes Pinkie think that everypony’s laughing at her, causing her to become angry and spiteful. He uses Rarity’s greed to make her belief a giant rock (which she later names Tom) is actually a diamond. He tries to make Fluttershy realize she’s weak and helpless, but since she already knows that, he just gives up and forces her to be cruel. And finally, he makes Rainbow Dash believe that Cloudsdale is falling, and offers her back her wings so she’ll save her home town. Each of the ponies give in, causing them to turn grey and start acting in the opposite way of their Element.
Once they’re all broken, he allows Twilight to find them all, leaving her confused as to what just happened. And to top it off, Rainbow Dash flies off, breaking the rules of the game and allowing Discord to start spreading his chaos even further, starting by tearing the hedge maze out and leaving only a bit crater. While her friends argue and fight, Twilight accuses Discord of cheating by making it impossible to find the Elements. That’s when he drops the final bomb: the Elements were never there. Twilight lead her friends into a trap for nothing.
Still, he gives them another chance, and this time, Twilight realizes that the Elements are back “where it all began:” Ponyville. She and her friends try to return home, but between the five getting worse and worse, Discord’s power also seems to be growing. He keeps changing the time of day, turns the road into soap, levitates buildings from the ground, and to top it off, has been driving everypony else mad, too. The gang barely makes it back to the library, by which point Twilight’s friends have devolved into complete jerks, going so far as to play keep-away with the book containing the Elements. Enraged at their behavior, Twilight slams the Elements onto everypony (including making Spike the new Loyalty) and leads them out to defeat Discord so they’ll never have to see each other again.
Fortunately, Discord is more than willing to give them a shot. Too bad the Elements no longer work; they can get a spark, but the rainbow won’t form. Discord taunts Twilight once again before leaving, while the others abandon her as well. Now completely alone, her own color finally vanishes, leaving Discord happy as can be as she sadly goes to the library, starts packing her bags to leave, and throws the Element of Magic away.
While she was gone, though, Celestia had been sending back all of her Friendship Reports, causing Spike eternal agony but also giving her a refresher course on what she had learned over the season. The old lessons gradually break down Discord’s influence, returning Twilight to normal and giving her the inspiration she needs to finally realize what’s truly important and defeat Discord.
She heads to Sweet Apple Acres, where Applejack is lying about trying to fight Discord but being abandoned by her so-called “friends.” Fortunately, all it takes is a quick spell to refresh her memory of her former self to restore the farm pony to normal. They quickly restore Fluttershy, Rarity, and Pinkie Pie in a similar fashion, but Rainbow Dash is missing. Fortunately, she’s actually just sitting on a cloud just outside her house, which she thinks is Cloudsdale. After a harrowing balloon chase, they finally capture her long enough for Twilight to use the spell, thus restoring all six just in time for the final battle.
Discord is lounging on his throne, drinking exploding chocolate milk while wishing he had a terrible rod to clutch, and is only annoyed when the six show up again with the Elements. Still thinking they’re under his control, he levitates the five he had previously controlled by the necklace, but Twilight quickly breaks them free with a force field. She delivers the episodes lesson (friendship isn’t easy, but it’s worth fighting for), but Discord is still not impressed and dares them to try to “friend” him again. Unfortunately for him, not only are they back to normal, but their friendship is even stronger than before…and they are not interested in “friending” him. The rainbow shoots out, this time even more powerful than when it was used on Nightmare Moon, and blasts Discord so hard that all of the chaos is completely undone within seconds. Even better, his expression is no longer that of a laughing, mocking creature, but instead one of abject fear.
Equestria has been saved, and Princess Celestia honors the six in a grand public ceremony.
REVIEW:
“Return of Harmony” is one of only two episodes of the show I will never, ever watch again under my own power. This is some of the darkest forty-five minutes you’ll ever see in a girl’s show, and it is often difficult to sit through, especially with the first two-thirds of the second half. And yet, that’s a testament to how much effort went into making an extremely dark, hopeless situation for our heroes to struggle through. It’s a shame that the two-parter also has some characterization problems, terrible pacing at the end, and again, is difficult to sit through. Were it not for John de Lancie’s near-perfect voice work, I would have rated this episode much lower than I did.
The opening scene in the garden is mostly there to set up the plot, and never mentioned again. To be fair, the design of the draconequus is extremely interesting, and perfectly reflects the chaotic mind and desires of the being who occupies this twisted form. There is, however, one thing I have to mention that people can’t seem to get: the CMC did not release Discord. If anything, their fighting just intensified because he was already breaking free. Still, the scene with him powering up and the statue cracking was a decent bit of foreshadowing.
The next scene establishes the kind of chaos we’re dealing with, and unfortunately, it’s not a very good scene from a show-wide perspective. The idea is to quickly reintroduce the cast after the break, but that doesn’t change the fact that some of the dialogue is painful and the scene goes on a bit too long. Still, it also provides a bit of foreshadowing by showing everypony working together, which will be contrasted later on after Discord finishes doing the nasty with their minds.
The scene with Celestia and Discord’s backstory is actually very character defining for her, as well as the biggest bit of fanon destruction in the season. The first season showed her as a magnificent bastard of sorts, working behind the scenes to manipulate everypony around her for the best outcome. This, in turn, led many of the fandom to believe she was an omnipotent, infallible god, and had ruled Equestria forever. But here, we learn that not only can she make tragic mistakes and not notice things until it’s too late, but we learn that Discord ruled Equestria, torturing the ponies for eons before Celestia and Luna wielded the Elements of Harmony. That’s also why Celestia cannot do anything; Discord is so powerful that the EoH are the only thing that can stop him, and since the Mane 6 are the Bearers, it’s up to them to save the day. The vault containing the Elements is a nifty way to explain why they never show up again, as well as to establish just how powerful Discord is when he can get around a door only Celestia can open.
There is one problem here that I need to address, though, and that’s Pinkie liking the chaos. She’s perfectly willing to allow Discord to run rampant if it’ll give her chocolate rain. And that…is just dumb. I will say no more.
And now we finally get Discord, shifting from window to window in a very good bit of animation. Of course, this scene is just there to set up how he’ll screw everypony over in the rest of the episode, but it also reveals who his voice actor is: John de Lancie, aka Q from Star Trek: The Next Generation. According to comments made after the fact, Lauren Faust got the idea after marathoning some Next Generation episodes, and they had planned to have a de Lancie sound-alike to voice him. But then someone suggested just getting the guy himself, he was open to voicing this little girl’s show he had never heard of, and so it began…
Another thing to comment on here is Discord’s comment about not turning ponies to stone. Some have taken this to mean that Celestia routinely turns ponies into statues whenever she’s not sending them to the moon. But before you jump to that conclusion, remember something very important about Discord: he’s a sociopathic monster whose only goal is to make everypony around him into his personal toys to torture forever and ever. We’ve already seen the negative effects of his eternal chaos, and the second half shows just how terrible things have gotten under his watch. Of course he wouldn’t turn them to stone; his games just aren’t fun if the players aren’t screaming.
So anyway, Twilight interprets the riddle to mean the hedge maze. Discord responds by allowing them to enter, but not before casually changing them all into Earth ponies and separating the group. This highlights just how powerful he is; he can casually change a pony’s species, teleport in and out of nowhere even easier than Twilight can, and can spring up hedge walls out of nowhere.
And thus we get to the “breaking” scenes, which are by far the second-best parts of the entire episode. Discord uses each Element’s properties against its owner to turn them into its opposite, thus causing them to turn grey. (And as we’ll see later, the worse the ponies get, the more color they lose.) Of these, I think I like Applejack’s the most; Discord highlights the downside of honesty, and convinces her that lying is worth it if it’ll make her friends happy. As for the least effective…well, I can’t say I really cared much for Rarity’s scene. Her greed and desire for gems is already established, so it was just hitting the same character point. Pinkie’s was okay, especially with her anguish over being laughed at. Rainbow Dash was also good in that Discord didn’t turn her against her Element; rather, he shifted her loyalty to a different place and situation. What happens to Fluttershy, though, highlights another bit of Discord’s monstrosity: he doesn’t have to do any of this. He could just touch them all, make them grey, and then leave. But he’d rather draw out their torment, make them suffer from their from own flaws and foibles, and only then will he finally break them.
Which leads us back to Twilight, since the rest of the episode will be about Discord (who can’t get a handle on her Element, i.e. a plot point) trying to break her by using her now-Discorded friends. As it turns out, his effect has made them act completely opposite of their Element now; Applejack is a liar, Pinkie has joined the Angry Marines, Rarity is obsessed with a rock she thinks is a diamond, Fluttershy is herself after taking Iron Will’s lectures, and Rainbow Dash abandons everypony with some wings Discord gave her, thus ending the game. And then Discord reveals that Twilight was wrong the whole time, meaning her friends are jerks because of her mistake. The look on her face is just tragic.
The rest of the episode continues this trend. Discord does something silly-but-threatening, her friends do jerkish things, and Twilight grows more and more frustrated at them. I know I’m rushing through a lot, but in all honesty, these bits are really just one prolonged plot point. I also don’t like how Discord’s corruption progresses; instead of continuing to encapsulate their anti-Element, they become generic jerks who play keep-away with the book. At best, Discord is controlling their actions to screw with Twilight even more. At worst, the team forgot what the episode was going for and just made them more generic to drive the point further.
Still, I like some of the madness involved. Tom slamming through the library wall was cute, as was Fluttershy stomping on the flowers for no reason. Discord turning the road into soap was actually a pretty inspired bit of madness. And I liked Spike’s reaction to the group (although this raises the question of why nopony else can see that her friends are grey), as well as him becoming the new Rainbow Dash (even if that meme wore out its welcome fast).
The next few scenes, though, are just depressing. Twilight, now thoroughly fed up and cursing her inability to see grey, tries to have the five (plus Spike) use the Elements, and Discord even just sits there. She manages to get a bit of a spark, but it only fizzles and dies, thus causing the group to split up. And finally, now abandoned by her former friends, Twilight finally breaks, going so far as to cry a single teardrop that turns into a broken heart. The moment works because of just how perfectly everything ties together. Twilight has been the one trying to take charge and save the day, and worked her flank off to keep everypony together after the maze. And now, her will is completely broken, and she turns to leave. We also get a little bit of Discord seemingly depressed over defeating his last adversary…only for him to immediately turn around and start cheering.
And then we get to the best part of the episode. Twilight throws the tiara away and begins to pack, but Spike has been burping up letters all day. (Poor guy.) All those letters? Twilight’s Friendship Reports, including what seems to be a few we didn’t get to see. As she reads through them, she’s reminded of just how important her friendships were to her, and how she’s changed over the course of the first season. This allows her to break free from Discord’s control and gives her the insight she needs to see what she has to do to save Equestria. And since I finally found the video (you have no idea how long it took), here you go:
It’s moments like this that make me sad that this was never planned to be the Season One finale, because it honestly feels like a true conclusion to that season’s arc of Twilight sending letters to Celestia. Through this one scene, we get to see just how much Twilight and the others have grown as ponies, how their struggles have shaped each other into better people, and just how important Friendship really is. And while “The Best Night Ever” tried to work in a huge number of plot lines and episode references, RoH works much better as a finale because it not only feels epic and grand, but also shows why these reports - and friendship in general - are so important to begin with. And thus, we can get to the last third, where the episode crashes and burns.
The biggest problem with Twilight un-Discording her friends is just how rushed it is. There’s about eight minutes of episode left, so they have to get through everypony as quickly as possible. Applejack gets an extended scene because she has to showcase just what Twilight’s doing to break the brainwashing, and while the memory spell might seem like a copout, I really have no issue with it whatsoever. Given just how bad her friends had gotten, there was no way she was going to talk them out of the mind rape, and she had to get things finished fast, so she just showed them her own memories of the events, which caused the victim’s mind to remember everything and break through. The problem, though, is that we should have seen something for everypony. It would have added a whole lot to their characters, and showed the same kind of development that Twilight and AJ got via their own memory spell experiences. I did like Rarity’s “Let us never speak of this again” response after dumping Tom.
The only other character to get an extended scene is Rainbow Dash. Her just…being on a cloud nearby stinks of, “We’re out of time, so let’s get this done fast.” The chase itself is appropriately tense, especially when Rarity and Pinkie get dragged along by the rope. I also liked Rainbow Dash’s movements after they bring her down; she bucks and snorts like a real, angry horse. And of course, this scene includes Fluttershy’s most epic lines in the episode:
And now we get to the episode’s biggest failing: Discord’s defeat. The scene starts impressive enough, with the draconequus (still not believing that they’ve broken his control, thus cementing pride as his fatal flaw) Force Choking five of the ponies through their necklaces. Twilight’s little force field is also a nice touch, especially when it restores the ground underneath her. And then we get the moral that friendship isn’t easy but worth fighting for, which I really do like. It’s just a shame that it’s said so quickly because of the rushed pacing.
And then Discord…just sits there and lets them beat him. Seriously, he makes zero effort to fight back, doesn’t try to escape, and even after he sees the Elements activating, it isn’t until the rainbow is barreling down on him that he realizes just how screwed he truly is. About the one good thing I can say here is that I loved his reaction here as opposed to when he was stoned last time. Then, he seemed to be actively mocking Celestia and Luna, perhaps even enjoying the experience. But now, his face is forever frozen in a look of sheer terror, which it should be. Not only was he defeated, but if the Elements are powered based on the bonds between each pony, then he’s just made them even stronger.
And now comes the part where I must be the bad guy and say, with all certainty and conviction, that Discord should never return. Ever. At most, he should just be used in a flashback or in the past, but not in the present. This is not a villain that can keep making repeat appearances and have the same impact. At best, he will just devolve into a joke, popping up to pull pranks and do silly things to upset the heroes. What makes Discord work is that he’s a legitimately terrifying villain. And the reason he’s legitimately terrifying is because he’s treated so seriously by the others. This is a guy who can warp reality to his whim, mind rape ponies by touch, and even make exploding chocolate milk…and he does this because he gets off to it. Sure, he might be the God of Chaos, but he loves his job, and has no qualms about torturing everypony he runs into for fun. He is a legitimate villain, and that’s why his defeat should be permanent. But apparently it won’t, because he’s coming back in Season Three. Whoop-de-fricking-do.
The last scene is a direct reference to the end of Star Wars: A New Hope, and it’s actually pretty well done. Celestia’s speech also gives it a very epic feel, which is perfect considering just who they managed to defeat. And thus, this episode finally draws to an end.
CONCLUSION:
“Return of Harmony” is a messy thing to judge, because quite frankly, it doesn’t feel like an episode of Friendship is Magic until the last act. And that’s actually part of its appeal. This is a very bold episode for the show to do, and pretty much marks the shift towards a slightly older demographic than before. Discord is also an effective villain, and by far the best one we’ve seen so far. However, the rest of the episode is just…meh. There are some great ideas here, but the whole story is so rushed that it never really has enough time to develop them. This really needed a third part, if only to make the ending more meaningful. So overall, about an average non-average episode.
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Well, that was a tough ride. Tune in next time for more reviews.
Would you mind my asking where you found out that Discord is (or might be) coming back?
Otherwise, another great review!
You did make me think of something though. I need to see if My Little Dashie was written before or after this episode.
Ah, the Return of Harmony. Quite possibly my favorite episodes.
I see you have your reservations about it, but I LOVE this two parter. It really taxed the heroes and made for some tense moments. Really, after the first episode, I had to wonder for a WEEK just what was going to happen to get them out of the predicament they were in. And it got MUCH worse before it got better.
I will agree that the final minutes of part 2 were incredibly rushed. I really expected Discord to put up more of a fight at the end, seeing as he had totally owned all the characters up to that point. It was pretty disappointing that he didn't give a last parting shot. I also agree that it would ruin the experience if Discord came back, but maybe it will only be in a quick cameo such as a flashback.
One final thing. I'm totally with you on how evil Discord is. In fact, if he had been repentant of his actions, I probably wouldn't enjoy him for the villain he is. He stuck to his chaotic guns and wasn't going to change for anypony. The fans trying to redeem him is cute, but very hard to pull off.
It's too bad you didn't get the kind of enjoyment out of this that I did. I always drop what I'm doing if I happen to catch it on air.
You really dislike the episodes that much? A large portion of your fictions are based solely on this episode, drawing out the details that they "didn't put in the show"
Admittedly I've re-watched this only once, it's just not the sort that's good for watching again.
Most 2-part episodes of any show are strongly plot driven, and while they develop the show significantly, and are quite memorable - they're not the sort that you have much motivation to re-live.
I'm reminded of any 2-part episode Star Trek or the X Files
When I re-watched this episode I remember imagining that there was a lot Celestia never said about her ordeal with Discord, how horribly injured she was, how complete his madness was, and how long the alicorn sisters spent in hiding.
They never said anything about Kuchen the Mad or Celestia's parents in the show, but we know how it "really" happened
Admittedly I don't care for this too much either, hopefully it's just a cameo, flashback, or reference to the events already established. They can't defeat him a 3rd time
I don't want to see MLP get into the phase of just re-visiting things that have already happened.
Don't mean to steer off-topic, but I see this in the new episodes of Futurama.
Do you watch Futurama? I'm sure some folks here watch it.
It was cancelled for a long time, and now they've brought it back on Comedy Central.
And like any long running show it's not the same as it used to be, and I think the problem is that they're not developing anything new, they're just re-visiting everything they've done before.
"let's go back to the robot planet"
"let's see the moon hillbillies again"
I don't want to see MLP go down that road.
"Discord was cool, let's do that again"
"How about this time, Photo Finish does a makeover on a reluctant Applejack"
Few things. First this seems like the season one finale because it really is. For some reason it wasn't entirely completed, or at least released until later but I remember something about the animation at least being finished at the end of season one, so I think it was always supposed to be the S1 finale it just wasn't because of some executive meddling or some such thing.
Second Pinkie liking the chaos at first just makes sense for her. To her it just means there is a free source of chocolate floating around, and how could that be bad? There are plenty of ways of course, but Pinkie not realizing this immediately fits her personality perfectly.
Finally I agree that Discord staying trapped, though he is a great bad guy so reusing him in some way could be great. There are plenty of stories where sneaks through the cracks to sorta get out, and at least some of them aren't that bad. The show's team might be able to do even better. Also an episode that shows his defeat the first time could be amazing.
352054 DeLancie himself confirmed that he had recorded another episode ages ago, I'm sure someone will link the panel where he said this
352213
Thanks for the info!
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Actually, I don't hate the episode. For what it is, it's really well executed. It's just not one of those episodes I would gladly rewatch every single time.
Agreed. I want to see the show keep evolving, trying out new things, expanding on the world the team's created, and exploring our cast on a deeper level. Discord was an amazing experiment, and it worked, but part of the reason why was because it was so out of left field for this kind of show. If they do another episode with him, it won't have the same effect.
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The team, Faust, and others have made it pretty clear that this was never intended to be the Season One finale. They started producing it during the first season because the show was such an immediate hit that Hasbro threw them big bushels of money to keep things going. Most shows don't have that luxury of knowing they'll have another season, especially in a franchise that has a huge stigma like this one. Like I said, though, this has the feeling of a season finale, and with "Lesson Zero" retooling the show to have the entire cast learn lessons and downplay the explicit letter writing, it really feels like the perfect capstone to that era.
Darn it. Discord's coming back? I want him to be one of those villians that's just defeated for good, that's it, they're not gonna come back.
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what do you mean discord is going to be back in season 3? is queen christalis going to also be in season 3? are they teaming up? will there be a new villain in season 3 also with discord?
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So far, the only concrete thing that we know is that John de Lancie is doing more voice-work. Now, that might not mean he's going to voice Discord again. He may be doing another character entirely. That's all.
As for other villains, no word on them either. We are pretty sure Trixie is coming back but that's it.
I don't know... I think that in some ways, it's a good thing that they acknowledge previous episodes/villains by having Discord come back, and i Love Jon De'Lancie, ( so glad they got him! *squee*) But I would prefer to see somepony like Chrysalis again... Discord would not be as powerful this time around, he would have to be truly EVIL, not as jokey for them to pull it off...
I did like this episode, just because I thought it was pretty powerful, but I agree that it's not one that I go back and watch continuously.
Nice review~ As always!
If Discord is making another appearance I really hope it is a flash back to when Celestia and Luna defeated him. That would be awesome.
You seemed to have a lot more positive than negative, but still concluded it as average. I liked this a lot, and don't see why you wouldn't want to watch it again. It was a bit rushed, but stretching MLP into three-episode parts is a lot for a kid's show like this. I like that pretty much any single episode of MLP can be enjoyed without watching the others before it.
As for Discord's return, from what I can tell the voice actor (de Lancie) is confirmed to return. Not the character. Remember that voice actors can voice many different characters. Discord is not necessarily returning.
I like this episode, but the ending was definitely rushed. I'm pretty sure Lauren confirmed it was originally supposed to be a three parter, but I can't remember where I saw it...
Also, we don't know for sure Discord is coming back. Last I checked, they said that De'Lancie was returning, not Discord. After all, Trixie's voice actress returned as Chrysalis, and Braeburn's as Shining Armor. Personally, I agree that bringing Discord back would only ruin his impact, unless they did it really well.
Since we're on the topic of Return of Harmony, have a tearjerking video!
I... you... SPOILERS! AAAARRRGGGHH! I've avoided season 3 spoilers SO HARD, and you've ruined it!
I'm very cross with you.
Right off the bat and you're already dropping a major point of contention. I admit this episode has its issues, but there is just so much more that I feel outweighs that.
Thank you. People not understanding this is a personal pet peeve.
I loved this scene. Maybe it was a little longer than needed to be, but painful dialogue?
That's not really a retcon. The stuff you go onto mention was all just fanon interpretation. Canonwise she was, and largely still is a pretty blank slate, and there's nothing her that conflicts with what we saw in S1.
Unfortunately I will. At this point Discord hasn't done anything all that evil, just wacky and silly. It's perfectly in keeping with Pinkies world view to enjoy all this, when so far it all seems like harmless fun.
Well since that scene happens after they all turn double gray, that might well have been the point. When they are just a little gray they are inverted but still somewhat recognizable characters, but after they go full gray there is basically nothing of who they really are left.
Well spike has been known to play around with the forth wall almost as much as pinkie, or maybe ponies are colorblind, but as Spike is a dragon... Actually there could be some merit to that idea. I don't think ponies are actually colorblind, but maybe as a Dragon Spike still has eyes that can see Discords corrupting influence.
Maybe I'm just screwed up, but this is one of my favorite sequences in the episode (maybe the whole series), because yes it ties everything so perfectly together. All the more so because discord never lays a finger on her. He sets Twilight up for a fall, but ultimately she breaks herself in a sequence somewhat the opposite of Discord's blatant cheating with Fluttershy. It's also the corresponding low needed to set the truly uplifting scene with the letters that follows.
Meh, never really bothered me, contrivences like that are par for the course in this kind of media. Plus it makes a bit of sense. Rainbow grabs 'Cloudsdale' and takes it back to her house where she can keep an eye on it. Normally that would just be silly, but under Discords chaotic influence it sorta works.
Again, this works for me. It ties back into pride as his defining flaw. He doesn't believe that mere Friendship could defeat his powers, and by the time he realizes better, it's too late to stop it. Sure it might seem like it takes the elements a long time to power up during which he could do something, but that's largely a matter of dramatic license.
I largely agree, but it is in my nature to give the people making this show the benefit of the doubt until proven wrong,.
True, but I can't blame them for such. Ambition is something that should always be admired, and even if this episode stumbles along the way due to time constraints, it was still trying to be something amazing, and I feel it largely succeeded.
What if discord had won? Would every last pony turn -dare I say it- generic?
Now all they need is a bar code or Doppler Effect CM... truly generic.
ANYWAYS... back to "topic". I enjoyed the show due to the relative darkness; sunshine and smiles don't pay the bills, not even in Equestria. De Lancie was a welcome addition for us Trek fans (though I cannot agree with his return; nty for the spoilers, I'll just forget them. But seriously, why couldn't they think "Hmm, Q2... how does DiscordII sound?). I'm sure that Spike noticing Twilight's friends' generic-esque coats was just another "This looks like a job for... CAPTAIN FREAKING OBVIOUS!!!"
This episode came as a welcome disappointment that I do not like to talk about much; my thoughts are too varied on it. I'd say I agree, but that would be a lie; I'd disagree, but that too is a lie.
Thusly, we do depart upon those few words of... something.
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Is that a new record?
The problem, though, was that you could still have him do something and still have his pride be his undoing.
One of the things I thought up when this question popped up elsewhere was that when he saw the Elements powering up, he could have tried to corrupt the six again by trying to worm himself back into their brains and showing them the same things as before. After all, it worked once, and it'll work again. Only this time, each pony has a counter to it. Applejack knows that it'll hurt her friends more if she lies. Pinkie Pie knows that her friends will never laugh at her. No matter how big the diamond, Rarity would never betray her friends. Fluttershy is not weak and helpless, and will do anything to help her friends in their hour of need. Rainbow Dash's loyalty is to her friends and Equestria, not just her hometown.
And when Discord gets back to Twilight, that's when she gives him the lesson. Not in a rushed sentence crammed between bouts of dialogue, but in a full-on Hannibal Lecture about the power of friendship that completely shatters Discord. He then snaps back to reality...just as the rainbow forms.
That's just one stupid idea. I can think of dozens more. Either way, I'd much rather he didn't just sit there and get defeated like that.
Yes, it did, and I admire what they tried to do. But at the same time, the episode isn't one I can easily rewatch. So much of it works because of the sheer shock of where the team's willing to go, and once that's gone, there just isn't too much that makes me gladly dig this one back up. I love what it did for the series and universe, but otherwise, I just find it okay.
My mistake. I was in a hurry finishing this up, and I ended up stumbling into the same thing I've yelled at others for doing. I'll go fix it now.
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The idea isn't stupid, but personally I prefer it the way it played out. Discord as a villain who is simply so powerfully that the mere idea of defeat is an impossibility to him (even though this is NOT the first time). That takes some seriously impressive levels of prideful arrogance.
It's okay; that's a trap we all fall into now and again. Part of the double edged sword that is high quality fanfiction.
>No opening bit
OKay i'm going to have to completely disagree with you here. I thought these were two of the best episodes of the whole series. I really do think you really emphasized just how awesome and sinister Discord is, and what you say they got right they did get right. If you don't like them that's fine, but here's my thoughts on some bits of your review.
That's really what makes it so good. Its because its so dark and twisted is what makes the episode work. As far as hard to sit through i have to disagree. The chaos seems more silly and comical but I admit the mind rape of the ponies is heavy. But kids could use some tougher material. And anything that's depressing in it is fitting for the scene and I thought that's what made it good.
Well....i think that's just Pinkie Pie. And its never said that she liked the chaos. She only liked the chocolate rain.
Because honestly that's kind of awesome. She just sees one silly advantage of a really bad thing; its just for a joke and referencing a meme.
I wouldn't say that. I would say that they are even more corrupted and thereby more jerkish. As far as "encapsulating their anti-Element" I'm not sure what you mean by that. Like Applejack becomes a bigger liar, or Rainbow dash is less loyal?
Again. its fitting for the scene. But yeah seeing Twilight go through that was sad.
I am with you when you say this should have been a season 1 finale. it does feel like they did evolve as characters. As far as the rushed ending. Well...you can only do so much in 30 minutes time. I can't fault them for having to rush the ending even a bit, the episode still works. But Fluttershy was awesome
Well you did say his pride is his ultimate flaw. I think this works. In an earlier scene where they tried to "friendship him" (i guess that doesnt mean Facebook friending him) he makes a face that looks like they might not be Dicorded, but since it doesn't work he's happy as can be! I think that was his ultimate downfall. he felt so proud of himself and he thought it wouldnt work again.
I agree that Discord SHOULD NOT COME BACK If they do it should only be in flashbacks. But you aren't entirely correct when you say Discord is back. JOHN DE LANCIE is doin stuff for season 3, that doesn't necessarily mean Discord is back.
Overall RoH is a personal favorite. If you don't like it, to eaches own. can't wait till the next reveiw
This is what sold me on the character. I've seen villains like Discord in kids shows before, and I've seen them standing triumphant, and they end up being sad and depressed and bored and deciding that it's no fun, and so going back to status quo.
Discord?
Discord loves seeing ponies suffer. It makes him happier than anything else. So there was the leadup of him looking depressed, and I was halfway through a sentance of commenting to my friends that I didn't like this, when he interrupted me with his gleeful "YYYYESSS!" and I became a happy camper.
I have a theory that Season 3 is going to have an "It's a Wonderful Life" episode, based off of those stills we saw of Carousel Boutique and Sweet Apple Acres in ruin (for, it looks like, some time). If this is the case, then Discord's return might just be in the "Pottersville" universe, meaning that Discord can be back and do evil things without having to necessarily up the ante on his previous appearance, or even equal it. If he simply shows up to drive home a point that "if you never came to Ponyville, Trixie," (fine, "Twilight"), "then Discord would rule! See!" then it could be okay. Functionally this is basically a flashback, then. Only more like a flash-sideways. Same difference.
We can hope...
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Discord highlights a rather huge problem people run into when writing serious villains: the more powerful they are, the less believable their defeat will be.
Just to give a non-pony example, Prometheus from Justice League: Cry for Justice is one of the most overpowered villains ever. He not only manages to come up with a scheme to teleport entire home cities of DC superheroes to other dimensions, blackmail almost every villain in the DCU to become distractions, manages to set up insanely complicated devices that are perfectly capable of repelling each city's hometown hero, and infiltrate the Justice League's headquarters to start the devices, but he manages to take down every single member of the team that comes at him. He defeats almost the entire Justice League. All of them. And even after he's finally subdued, he not only still destroys Star City, Green Arrow's home (and kills Roy Harper/Red Arrow's five-year-old daughter as well), he's also installed counter-measures for every possible means of coercing the shutdown sequence for the devices out of him short of just letting him go. So because the plot has essentially turned him into a flat-out unstoppable force, the heroes have no choice but to free him.
And what happens after? Right after he gets back to his pocket dimension headquarters, Green Arrow just walks up and shoots him through the eye. If he was anywhere near as powerful as they had kept showing him to be, there is no way he would have fallen for something that stupid and anti-climactic. But no matter what they did, it would have been simply impossible to make his defeat dramatic or important because they've spent so much time building up his unstoppable nature that it becomes a joke.
Discord is nowhere near as badly written, but he still exhibits the same issue. He's essentially a god in terms of power. Not only that, but he's shown to be in complete control of the situation from start to end, manipulating the heroes into betraying each other and going in the wrong direction. In other words, the only way to defeat him was to make him an idiot.
In fact, this is true of all of the super-powerful baddies in the series so far. Nightmare Moon practically wrote the Mane 6 step-by-step instructions for understanding the Elements of Harmony. Chrysalis was only defeated because she dismissed the power of the emotion her species fed on and which, mere moments earlier, had been the one thing to keep her from being overwhelmed by Celestia's power. Sunset Shimmer had the world's dumbest plan, nearly ruined her own schemes, and was defeated because she ignored how everyone kept screaming how wonderful and important friendship was. In fact, Sombra is the only one I will say was not an idiot, as he actually took a lot of precautions to keep the one thing that could end his reign of terror locked away, set up alarms and traps to guard it, and actively tried to keep it out of the heroes' grasp once he knew they were after it. He was only defeated because of events he could not have foreseen happening.
Actually, I'd love to hear it.
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Sorry it took so long to respond.
The idea of Celestia using Discord isn't a new one, but your idea is actually really damn cool. It's something that would be worth exploring, especially considering your point how the explanation for why Celestia cannot beat him this time sounds rehearsed. I don't necessarily agree (I think he's just what he says he is), but it's a really interesting theory.
...
Sorry. I'm not very verbose today.