Beneath the microscope, you contain galaxies.
Pony names are mysterious. Is Applejack Applejack Apple? Does Rarity have a second name? Did ponies whose names match their cutie marks change their names when they got them? But what I'm suddenly curious about, what would tell us so much about pony anthropology, is...
Who was named "Cake" first, Mrs. Cake or Mr. Cake?
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well if pony marriage nomenclature works the same as human's, then it would be Mr. Cake and Ms. Whatever, then when Ms. became Mrs., she took the name Cake. as for Applejack, I think the Apple in her first name serves as her surname (kinda like Japanese surnames being put first) which would mean her real name is actually Jack Apple.
Rarity Belle has a ring to it that I like.
I like the idea that "cake" as a last name for ponies is like "smith" for us humans.
I'm guessing that 'Apple' is more of a Clan name than a family name, so there's that. I've seen several fanfics changing her actual name to something entirely different, like 'Jackie Apple'
Rarity might be 'Rarity Belle'
I don't think ponies change their names to fit their marks, though I suppose it's the more realistic thing if you disregard the natural magic aspect of Equestria
They were both named Cake. They're siblings
Just look at this little red light and it will answer all your questions...
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This sounds like a premise for a story involving Cheerilee. //dl.dropbox.com/u/31471793/FiMFiction/emoticons/misc_Cheerilee.png
Hmm, I don't have any theories, but I might be able to pull up another blog that discussed this. I'll re-post if I find it.
You pose a very compelling quandary.
I suppose it... I mean if you look at... er. That is to say...
I think they just use this: My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic Name Generator
I don't think there is any rhyme and reason to pony names anymore.
Maybe there were some traditions in every region of Pre-Equestria, but since the unification under Celestia and Luna those have been mixed and eventually lost.
Now it's a free-for-all: Pick a name, any name!
And they is there Twilight Sparkle and then her brother is Shining ARMOUR??
Interesting question. To add complexity to the situation, watch the flashback scenes in "Family Appreciation Day" and you'll see that A.J.'s *great*-grandmother has what looks an awful lot like a metal-working Cutie Mark, and thus, literally, she's part of the Smith family. She married a seed-collector, and had a daughter whose talent is pie-making, but the daughter character is still named "Smith". A supportable scenario: Female family names trump male family names upon marriage, opposite of the modern Western American custom. A.J.'s mother is Apple Family, and met A.J.'s father, a Mr. Smith, because of their mutual interest in apples (Zap Apples are the Smith Family farm's claim to fame, and apples would perforce be A.J.'s mom's special talent and area of interest.) So Sweet Apple Acres only became synonymous with the Apple Family *after* A.J.'s dad married her mom.
This is kind of a silly exercise in psychological gymnastics, isn't it, but in the end, overanalysis is best analysis.
I think that Mr. and Mrs. Cake were both Cakes before they were married. Not that they were related, but simply that He is Carrot Cake and she was Cup Cake and they met and married and had two foals they named Pound Cake and Pumpkin Cake.
I don't believe that pony names normally falls that way. Rather it worked for the series to do that. Shining Armor is not Shining Armor Sparkle and will not take on Cadenza nor will Cadance become Mi Amore Cadenza Armor.
But that could be just me taking the show at face value... which is normally wrong, so yeah.
I actually have a lot of fun with this question. Bonbon Dulcinea, Fluttershy Poseysfilly, Mayor Marion Mare, Soarin' Markov... There's just so much fun to be had.
To answer your questions with my headcanon: Yes, Belle, sometimes, and both.
This is why the show will never be as accepted in Japan.
457808 well if pony marriage nomenclature works the same as human's, then it would be Mr. Cake and Ms. Whatever, then when Ms. became Mrs., she took the name Cake.
So you're saying she took the Cake?
In a world ruled by mares, where the mayor is a mare, most of the important people are mares, and most of the stallions just hang around doing guard duty, pulling plows, or waiting for mares to ask for something... mightn't it be the other way around?
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In other news, today the featured box has no "mature" stories in it.
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Apparently it is more confusing then figuring out the family tree of the Royal Sisters with Cadence and Blueblood as cousins to the princesses.
One example that would support of the last part of the name, as a family name, would be the Cake Family since they have the last word "Cake" in their name:Carrot Cake, Cup Cake, Pound Cake, and Pumpkin Cake. Another case would be Pinkie Pie's full name: Pinkamina Diane Pie
However if that were to be their arguments against this since, more then not, have a singular name if not have a second part of the name doesn't match up with the other family members. One example would be Twilight Sparkle and her brother Shining Armor:
Twilight Sparkle = Miss Sparkle
Shining Armor ≠ Mister Sparkle
It seems that it is up to the fans to deal with if there is a family name in the world of "My Little Pony"
I also have this head canon of Rarity's full name being "Rarity Belle", or even "Rare Belle" where "Rarity" is a nickname she took on as nom de plume.
457809 Rarity Belle has a ring to it that I like.
a ring to it
Seriously, though. It sounds like "Liberty Bell".
I think in Equestria it is Theme naming, not a carry-over of an actual name. Carrot Cake is therefore related to Carrot Top (who in my headcanon runs the Golden Harvest Grocery).
This holds true with Granny Smith, as her name fits the metalworking and apple traditions of both of her parents.
Perhaps her child married a distiller, thus giving us Macintosh (a cider apple), Applejack (apple-based whiskey), and Apple Bloom ('Bloom' being both a literal flower and a flavor descriptor).
Twilight Sparkle and Shining Armor both have a lusterous gleam in their names (Sparkle and Shining), but the other parts of their names don't really line up. Unless you do something headcanonish with the other parent, which could make sense of it, like making their mother a Night Steward in the castle.
Rarity and Pinkie Pie both seem to be the type of pony to use an assumed name. Rarity would choose hers to make her brand, and Pinkie Pie because "Pinkamena Diane Pie" just sounds so fun to tell to foals.
Oddly, this means in my headcanon that ponies in similar backgrounds would have similar names without necessarily having similar genetics. The Apple clan as we know them are all descended from the roving band of seed collectors, but who is to say that the seed-growers union was a family operation?
If they were to take each others' names, though, would that make it Princess Mi Armor Cadenza, or possibly Capt. Shining Amore?
Other fics have provided us with oracular naming (waiting until the foal is born, and magically knowing what to call them), or, hilariously, each pony being given a list of two-dozen potential names that they can pick once their cutie mark has come in...
I think that there may be a family name that isn't commonly used, that's more to describe the "herd". Take the Apples as an example.
They're all part of the "Apple" family, but that family name isn't necessarily a part of their personal name. Perhaps it can be, if they want it to be, but it doesn't need to be. My own personal head-canon is that ponies get to choose their own names, at least to an extent. So, Macintosh may be Macintosh Apple, or he just may be Macintosh, who's part of the Apple family. It's up to him to decide.
For Applejack and Apple Bloom, their family name is already incorporated into their personal name, so calling themselves "Applejack Apple" or "Apple Bloom Apple" isn't really needed.
For ponies who's cutie marks match their names, I think that whatever magic occurs to give them their mark also helps to shape the mark to match their name.
457825
He's actually called Sparkle Armour, but everyone agreed that was too gay.
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> you'll see that A.J.'s *great*-grandmother has what looks an awful lot like a metal-working Cutie Mark, and thus, literally, she's part of the Smith family
The idea that she was a literal smith instead of an in-name smith startled me, because I was trying to sort out the actual canon there as part of research for my historical adventure crossover and I didn't remember that. Went back and checked screenshots: Great-Granny Smith has a sewing machine, and Great-Grampy Smith has an acorn surrounded by a few other seeds.
I'm with you, though, on Smith being relevant as more than an apple varietal.
For what it's worth, the headcanon I'm writing into my story is that historical earth ponies have three names:
1) Allonym: they take the name of a passed-on loved one or admired historical personage, in order to honor them and have them live on in some fashion.
2) Birth name: rarely used after Markhood, except in disambiguation.
3) Ekename: Identifies them by trade (or hometown); thus, sometimes (but not always) related to their Cutie Mark. This is not strictly speaking a family name -- loyal colts and fillies carry those through the allonyms -- though if a family strictly maintains the same trade, it might look like one.
So Pinkamena Diane Pie, born Diane and working in a family of bakers, is honoring the legacy of some former Pinkamena.
Of course, as with our own world, modern naming has fallen far from the historical standard. Even some unicorns, who didn't used to respect the convention, have adopted the old earth-pony ekename (n.b. to 457853: Shining Armor, the guard, and Twilight Sparkle, the mage), while most earth ponies have dropped it or twisted it (Applejack puts her ekename first).
Overanalysis truly is best analysis. (And more useful than it sounds. In my story, the allonym convention is actually a plot point several times.)
457825
MAJOR PLOT HOLE DETECTED
REPORT TO HASBRO IMEDIATLY
Well, I know that in some native north-american cultures it was quite common to change names when a particular even happened in a person's life.
457815 Ponies are wonderful, aliens do not exist, thank you for your time ladies and gentlemen.
Much has been bandied about, but I'll toss my hat in here. Basically, Skywriter introduced it for me, anyway. And just to get it out there, this likely won't jive entirely with canon, and requires some bending to make work (like most things?).
In short, I presume a persistent family/clan name system that follows matrilinear descent.
In slightly longer: Equestria has, since time immemorial as far as we know, been matriarchal: for at least a good ~1500+ years we've had the twin princesses Celestia and Luna, and even before that we had the species-clan leaders: Princess Platinum is clear enough, though Commander Hurricane and Chancellor Puddinghead have less clear names (and could have been retconned out of stallionhood to jive with the mareocracy that succeeded them).
This would mean that Mr. Cake took his wife's name, which was then passed to her children.
Now, something like Twilight's presumable family name Sparkle is harder to reconcile, particularly if you subscribe to the pre-G4 headcanon that her parents are Night Light and Twilight Velvet (I personally like Orion and Star Sparkle as fanon names). And then there's Shining Armor, as mentioned above. This would be where it needs some more serious bending; for example, Shining Armor Sparkle, with the family name dropped in practical use because it's a mouthful (though now it would technically be Shining Armor Cadenza). Or, hell, you could retcon that career officers in the royal guard leave their family houses, etc, etc.
I'm also a fan of Rarity Belle, but there's more headache involved in Applejack and family. Apple? Smith? Apple-Smith? I've seen all three used...
So TLDR mileage may vary; I like static family names, and matriarchy lends to a matrilineal descent.
457876
Maybe Rarity has a relative named Liberty.
457988
Sewing machine! Augh! I thought it was a hammer. Guess I'm not going to get my cutie mark in identifying cutie marks.
Saw Jacqueline Apple in a fic once, I'm rather fond of that as AJ's full name.
I have no idea!
I'm more fascinated by the use of "real," or human names, for instance, "Doughnut Joe."
457826 457988 Skywriter, looks like you've been out-overanalyzed.
458160, 457988
There is no shame in losing to a warrior of such skill.
Warning: The content below this line features links to TVTropes. Reader discretion is advised. Improper use may result in excessive consumption of time and decreased work output.
On the topic of pony names, I simply attribute irregularities to the Rule of Cool. I assume readers enter with the willing suspension of disbelief necessary to accept names may not make sense within the context of being assigned at childhood but become relevant at a later stage of life.
Hi,
Rule of cool and suspension of disbelief may work for the show, but this is fanfiction - it's serious business.
I think maybe ponies have 'child names', which they're given by their parents, and 'adult names' which they choose for themselves once they get their cutie marks.
Perhaps there's male and female version of surnames. So Twilight Sparkle is Twilight Sparkle, and her mother is Starlight Sparkle, but her father is Shining Night as Shining Armor is Shining Armor. I'm lucky though. Since armour is spelt armour, when I use Armor, it's clear that it's referring to his name.
J.
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*bows* If I have shown great skill today, it is because no less would suffice against such opponents.
Unrelated headcanon: Rainbow Dash's hair. Inherited genetically, but it's the result of overexposure to magical radiation once upon a time in her ancestry, and quite likely related to her ability to Rainboom.*
--
* If you want to really dig in: Cultivated by Celestia generations ago as part of her master plan for NMM's return.
As an Anthropology major, I am happy I'm not the only one thinking this stuff through.
I also just noticed there is no Daring Do emoticon. dl.dropbox.com/u/31471793/FiMFiction/emoticons/sillyfilly_Rainbow_Dash.png
http://sliceofponylife.tumblr.com/post/25054973194
It could also be that different types of ponies have different naming conventions, like different human cultures have different naming conventions. So most earth ponies have inherited surnames (like the Pies and the Cakes), but unicorns do not (Like Twilight Sparkle and Shining Armor). And pegasi are just weird.
Based off a few theories and my own thoughts, I had constructed my own theory on how the naming scheme applies.
First off, in most cases across Equestria, the passed name comes not from the father, but from the name of the parent you share a gender with. While each town may have it's own convention, that basic rule applies to pretty much everything.
Ponyville Convention:
The most basic one is much like our own, the child inherits their last name from their parent. So X Belle would give birth to Rarity Belle and Sweetie Belle. Rarity later dropped Belle because it's sounds better as a business, and she anted to be independent. Carrot and Cup both share the last named Cake, so Pound Cake and Pumpkin Cake take the Cake.
Canterlot Convention:
However, up in Canterlot, something slightly different takes place. Instead of taking last names, they take first names. So two theoretical ponies named Twilight Twinkle and Shining Star could have a Twilight Sparkle and Shining Armor. So Fancy Pants comes from a line of Fancy's, Sapphire Shore from Sapphire's, etc...
Apple Convention:
We know that the Apple Clan came from somewhere that wasn't Ponyville or Canterlot. There names are given similar to Japanese names, while the first name is passed down as in Canterlot, it is the family name as in Ponyville. So a mare from the Apple side of the family and a stallion from Macintosh side could have an Apple Jack, an Apple Bloom, and a Macintosh X.
Buffalo Convention:
The Buffalo naming works similar to Native Americans, they are given a kind of 'placeholder name' until they prove themselves. For buffaloes, they don't earn cutie marks, they earn names. Chief Thunderhooves got his for being the strongest/loudest, Strongheart for being the most courageous (how many buffalo would do those acrobatics on the train?), etc.
Missing Parent Convention:
If a parent is gone, or name is unknown, there are two ways this is handled, depending on where you are. In a place like Ponyville, if your same gender parent was missing, you'd have no last name (Scootaloo comes to mind). In Canterlot, however, where lineage is more important, you would get branded with a more obvious name (Pony Joe anyone?).
Other Species Convention:
While we have a few names from other species, there isn't much to go on. Gilda, Gustave, Muleia, Matilda, Cranky, Daisy Jo and Iron Will don't tell us much other than griffons seem to be French and mules like alliterative names. Garble, Crackle and Spike likewise give us little knowledge into the naming of dragons, and it's likely we won't know any kind of naming schemes for any of these guys any time soon.
Pegasus Convention:
And finally, the mysterious Pegasus naming. As we know very little about the families of any pegasus, there isn't much that can be determined here. Based off Rumble and Thunderlane, we can see there is no connection in the first name, but the last name is unknown. It's possible pegaus generally have one name, as Rainbow Dash seems to be the main exception, and she seems the type that would alter her name if given the name Rainbow. I think that Pegasus nomenclature gains nothing from the parents, to distance the children from the parents, set them apart, so they can be their own pony. But until we meet a Mrs. Dash, a Mrs. Fluttershy or a Mrs. Scootaloo's mom, we can't really tell.
457815
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"We didn't name you Apple Bloom so you could grow up to be the president."
458443
Clearly, Celestia is The Emperor of Mankind reincarnated as a pony and RD is the first generation of a new breed of Space Marines. Mmmmm. I would totally read that fic.