“Oh, you don’t call them that,” Velar said, raising his voice a little. “You’re so good at the act. But when it comes right down to it, don’t the pegasus ponies end up a lot like citizens in Equestria? They sit on their clouds, with the easiest jobs making weather and things… then there are the free people, you unicorns. You’re the scholars, priests, skilled laborers. Then the worst jobs… farming, ditch digging, drawing water… that’s for the earth ponies. Your slaves. It’s basically the same system, isn’t it? You’ve just found a more… bureaucratically advanced way to manage them. Instead of being formally owned, your slaves are trapped by their living expenses and their cutie marks. I don’t see what makes your way any better than ours.”
“You really think…” Starlight opened and closed her mouth several times, struggling to find words. Velar’s argument was so patently absurd to her, she almost didn’t even know where to begin. So instead of looking for all the problems, she tried to find any way he might be right. What would a predatory bird see and look at as proof that ponies and birds weren’t different?
“Not all earth ponies do work like that. They can—”
Velar raised his voice again. “Oh, I didn’t know earth ponies could make weather.”
She blinked, stammering. “I-I mean… earth ponies can…”
“Cast spells?” Velar interrupted again. “I know you don’t allow the Old Magic. No blood spells for Equestria, you’re much too civilized for that. So only unicorns can do that. And if I remember my research… Princess Twilight was raised from a unicorn, and Cadance from a pegasus. Can’t help seeing a pattern there.”
Velar laughed then, touching her lightly on her shoulder with a wing as though they had been pleasantly joking with each other this whole time. “I don’t mean to argue with you, Starlight Glimmer. I don’t think it’s wrong that ponies organize their society. It’s proof to me that you’re civilized.
Starlight Glimmer shivered involuntarily as he said it, backing away another step. “Th-that… that point of view isn’t going to convince the ponies of Equestria. Even knowing you don’t have pony slaves won’t be enough forever.”
Velar shrugged. “We never expected ponies to transform yourselves into birds, Starlight. Do you honestly think ponies will expect us to do the reverse?”
Yes, Starlight thought, though she didn’t say so. When she thought about it like that, it sounded absurd. But that wasn’t the way ponies had ever seen it, and that didn’t seem likely to change.
“I’m just glad I’m not the one who has to make decisions like that,” Starlight finally said. “Equestria has princesses for that. All I have to do is what they tell me. I’ll never have to worry about being in charge.”
Velar shrugged. “It has advantages. And disadvantages, like birds trying to kill you. Guess pony succession doesn’t involve much assassination either.”
“Not anymore,” Starlight said, though she didn’t get a chance to continue. The sound of a bell echoed from within the building behind them, signifying the end of the first session. “They’ll want me,” Starlight said. “I’m only here as an advisor, and…”
Velar waved one wing. “Go on, then. Share all your secret knowledge about our ways. But don’t forget about your promise—I will be looking forward to that tour of Canterlot.”
Starlight found herself unable to meet the griffon’s eyes as she headed back into the palace.
Of course, calling it that was a tad generous just now—there was so much unfinished stone, and the whole structure looked barely stable enough to occupy. She had seen from the air that many of the upper levels were unfinished as well.
But considering they only had a month to build this, it seems to be coming along pretty well. Griffons didn’t have the new steel-frame construction methods being used in Manehattan—those innovations required resources the birds just couldn’t get in Equestria.
There were many ponies and birds packed inside—guards and advisors and ordinary citizens. Starlight teleported across the room in a series of short jumps, avoiding the densest crowds and searching out the biggest pocket of guards. She found her princesses in one quiet corner, conversing in hushed voices. The Solar Guard let her through without objection, even as they barred off all others.
All four of Equestria’s rulers were here, in various states of confusion. Starlight bowed to them all, though she directed her attention primarily on Twilight. Twilight Sparkle had been more closely involved with this negotiation than anypony else—Celestia and Luna were occupied with keeping the climate stable, while Cadance’s northern land was already beginning to suffer as the climate changed. Even getting away for a single day was probably difficult for them.
“Was I right, Twilight?” she asked. “About their demands?”
Princess Twilight Sparkle nodded slightly, almost imperceptibly. “They want more than just hiring weatherponies. Some of the other cities want… want to send birds into Equestria.”
Starlight froze. Her mind immediately conjured an image of a tight flock, wings beating together as they closed in on some southern Equestrian city. Dodge Junction, perhaps.
“You don’t look like you thought about that.”
She nodded. “I haven’t, Princess.” She glanced around the room—there were many birds in here, though just as many slaves and servants. The earliest stipulations of the treaty had required that no pony slaves be kept once they entered Equestrian lands—but these were such a rare thing that it hadn’t been much to ask.
“Did they give a reason? Numbers, anything like that?”
Twilight nodded again. “Basically, that they have too many skilled workers and not enough for them to do. New Scythia was prepared to uproot its economy, but lots of the other cities weren’t. Lots of birds want to be able to fly north to practice their trades in Equestria—either to raise money, or to drive up interest for griffon goods.”
“We were eager to hear what you might think of such a possibility,” Luna said, obvious tiredness in her voice. But then, the night princess rarely sounded awake when the sun was up. “Whether or not we can trust individual griffons to keep to the terms of their agreements as well as the nation as a whole. Surely nopony would be happy to see so many strangers arriving in their cites… but the alternatives are worse if we refuse them.”
Nopony had to speak those out loud. Starlight could imagine them easily—if the birds really didn’t have enough work to do, then many of their citizens wouldn’t have the money to feed their families. Their nobility had stockpiled supplies, but no way they had enough to feed huge segments of a once-productive population.
Discontent and suffering in griffon lands would not directly impact ponies at first. But over time, it might leave the birds no recourse but to steal what they needed. Or worse, it might push their whole society towards war.
“It’s not individual birds that we should be worried about,” Starlight eventually said. “Free noncitizens are generally only trying to look out for their families. They’re living from one paycheck to the next, they don’t have huge stockpiles of wealth, and they don’t have much say in griffon society. Many of them aren’t even birds. I wouldn’t worry about any of these if they wanted to come and work—except that they might not want to come back.
“I do worry about citizens, though. They often own hundreds or thousands of slaves. I would worry about them sending their slaves north to work for lower wages than a pony could work, before sending all the money back to their master. The slaves don’t get to improve their station, and our own ponies might lose their jobs.”
Twilight and Celestia shared a meaningful glance. Celestia’s horn glowed faintly, and it seemed as though the sound around them abruptly faded. It was as though they had stepped into a quiet room.
Presumably that meant that anypony outside their little pocket of quiet wouldn’t be able to hear them either.
“I see a pattern forming,” Princess Celestia said, her voice sounding sad and distant. “The griffons may not be armed with superior weapons and airships… yet. But they are still an implacable enemy. I fear we may be sacrificing Equestria one hoofstep at a time. Each new compromise yields a little ground to the altar of greater cooperation with these birds, until it is too late to resist them if they change their minds.”
“I still think the best hope for a peaceful solution is to grant their request for weatherponies,” Cadance said. “The Accipian empire lives the way it does because they haven’t seen any other way. If we provide them that way—they may find they like it better.”
“Certainly,” Luna agreed. “But realities are fixed. Griffons will not gain more magic simply by living on our soil. They could not use it as the foundation for their society even if they wanted to.”
The conversation went on for a few minutes longer. Starlight couldn’t tell what Celestia would decide, though it seemed she grew more worried as the moments passed.
Though she couldn’t hear anything from outside the bubble, Starlight could see the moment when the meeting must have been reconvened, because traffic started moving back towards the audience chamber beyond. Celestia’s horn stopped glowing, and she said her farewells to the princesses.
A few hours later, and it was over. Starlight watched as the princesses flew back to their airship hovering in the sky, chariots rising rapidly away from the little griffon city.
Starlight remained on the ground, beside a small group of guards and the emperor’s delegation.
“It isn’t what we wanted.” Velar’s voice from behind her, so suddenly she nearly jumped. Probably would have, except that she was so used to that kind of behavior from him that she had trained herself not to react. That was what he wanted, and she wouldn’t give him the satisfaction.
“That’s how negotiation is meant to be,” she said, without turning around. “If either party is happy with the result, it means someone was treated unfairly. Compromise is what nopony wanted.”
The not-prince snorted with laughter. “Spoken like a pony if ever I heard it.” He emerged beside her, following her gaze up to the Stalwart Stratus. Already it was hard to see the four chariots as they neared it—though if the griffon’s massive flagship had still been up there, it would probably look like a child’s toy.
“Seriously though, birds are going to be upset about this. Barring slaves or anyone with slaves from working in Equestria—that’s almost every citizen in Accipio. Probably is every citizen.”
She shrugged. “I told you ponies wouldn’t see things the way you did. Besides, from what I saw of your census, it hasn’t restricted most of you. And the ones it has will be fine. Birds like you can still visit, anyway. You don’t know how big a compromise that is. A decade ago, nopony would’ve even considered it.”
Velar sighed. “I suppose it was wishful thinking that this treaty would be easy. Unity knew we couldn’t keep living here the same way we lived anywhere.”
Starlight hesitated. Then she leaned in a little closer to him, whispering. “If it really causes trouble, I could probably get them to renegotiate in a few months. Once we have lots of evidence to point to as reasons they should reconsider.”
Velar grinned. “I’ll let you know. You’re right that it won’t hurt most citizens. They’ll be sour they can’t send their slaves to work Equestrian markets, but I can’t imagine any of them going hungry. If they had the wealth to make it here with their households, they’ll have the wealth to keep surviving.”
The Stratus began to move. At this vast distance, its acceleration seemed slow, though she knew from experience it had one of the new impeller engines. It would be back in Canterlot before morning.
Without me on it.
As part of the treaty, an Equestrian embassy would be erected here in New Scythia. Starlight Glimmer had been given all the resources she needed to set it up. I wonder if Trixie would be willing to move down here for a while. I bet griffons would love her magic shows.
“Do you really think two hundred pegasus ponies will be enough?” Velar asked, interrupting her thoughts. “It was less than half of what we wanted.”
Starlight Glimmer didn’t want to give the honest answer—not when she knew it would bring no confidence to the not-prince. “Depends how good they are. If Celestia said they would send the best, I’m sure she meant it. It should be enough for New Scythia to change its climate, even if it isn’t enough for any of the other cities. But maybe the other clan lords will want to broker their own contracts with Equestria. Once they see how well it works down here…”
Velar laughed. “That depends on the first harvest. Lots of grain, happy livestock… maybe they’ll consider it. How often do crops fail in Equestria?”
They didn’t, but that was more than just weather. Earth ponies tending the fields, unicorns to cure blights before they got severe and to keep pests away… griffons simply couldn’t farm that way. “Never,” she said.
“Good.” Velar forced a smile. “How about some wine before you retire? You must be worn from a tough day of negotiating.”
“Sure,” she answered without thinking. “I might like that.”
As I expected. An outside perspective looking in and mapping what it sees on what it knows. Velar doesn't see the earth pony entrepreneurs, the ground-level pegasi, the working-class unicorns, nor do I expect him to.
As for the treaty... this could really go either way. Getting only a third of the Equestrian agricultural engine leaves a lot of room for crop failure, and the griffon workers could lead to all kinds of potential culture clashes. Everything could go fantastically, yes, but there wouldn't be much if a story if it did.
So, blood magic is a thing for gryphons? do they sacrifice captured warriors in altars to the gods, Aztec style?
So I guess I wasn't too far off. Slaves= Working Class?
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SO. MUCH.TENSION.
Starlight is friends with Maud, so it would be interesting to see her visit. I wonder if Velar's opinion of earth ponies would change after meeting her.
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Serfdom
A working class can only exist if the worker doesn't have to give up part of his income to a master.
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Ok, Serfdom.... That's probably the best word for it.
Velar's voice came from behind her, or something similar.
Needs a closing quotation mark.
Velar's complete lack of a good point is hilarious, but perhaps moreso is the similarity to actual headcanon I've seen that try to rationalize earth ponies as a slave race. It's like nobody knows what actually happens when one tribe controls all the food.
Oooh, if you're taking suggestions, an earth pony joining the embassy in New Scythia would shake things up delightfully. Maybe Filthy Rich or somepony like that.
Also, calling it now, that wine is a bad idea.
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This. Totally this. It'd be the first time I'd be happy to see Filthy Rich in a long time.
Great chapter. So that answers my question regarding pony slaves. Glad they were freed, few as they apparently were. Excellent meeting of the princesses and Starlight as well. I wouldn't have even considered the possibility of gryphons trying to use slave labor to undercut Equestria. I'm happy they're not allowing that crap in their cities. You've gotten me curious about the Crystal Empire now too. An already icy region such as that must be suffering more than most. Hopefully the crystal ponies can manage. Update again soon!
Well, at least they have some idea of when to agree to disagree.
Now let's see what happens when their tongues loosen a bit....
Ooooh, so that's what he was thinking. His view is 'we have slaves, so Equestria has to have them' It's sort of like how at one point we imagined nothing could live at the bottom of the ocean without sunlight, he can't imagine a civilization not having slavery as an innate part of it.
Hmmm... Can see some tension's getting tenser in the future... I hope EVERYONE will get trough this mostly unscathed.
Velar and Starlight... my shipping senses are tingling
I'm really interested to see where this story goes. I have to confess I didn't expect Valar's point about Equestrian society to be so...blatantly off. I thought he'd have more of a point, something to be like "Oh, I guess we as ponies never thought about how we are treating our non-pony citizens" or something, but all he had was an astonishingly ignorant perspective completely unreliant on facts. But what I REALLY found frustrating was that Starlight didn't make more of an effort to show him how incorrect his assumptions were. She's a much better negotiator and debater than that; it felt kind of weak that she left their argument without even giving him anything to think on, that she couldn't give him a few examples of high-profile earth ponies considered equal to any other citizens in Equestria (I mean, Gladmane from Las Pegasus was a cheat, but he owned an ENTIRE CASINO - not exactly a poor pony OR a farmer). Also, his idea that pegasus ponies are superior just because they can fly and do weather control and that they always have the easy life is laughable.
I will grant you, though, that I am starting to realize just how similar their culture is to Roman culture. The recognition that there are 'citizens' and 'free non-citizens' made me realize it where I'd missed it before. Citizens in Roman culture DID have rights that other conquered nations didn't have, such as not being allowed to be imprisoned arbitrarily. What Valar obviously doesn't understand is that literally EVERYpony has the same rights in Equestria, that everypony has a choice in their occupation (whatever their talents may be to guide them), and that there are no 'non-citizens' (at least as far as we've seen for sure in the show). Another thing I find interesting is what was revealed about how much disdain Valar apparently has for farmers. Clearly in griffon society, anyone who has to actually work the earth is so low as to be worthy of servitude. How ironic that the privileged so often have such views on those without whom they would starve.
Overall, there are so many points Starlight could have made showing how patently wrong Valar is that having them just walk away from it untouched left me with a deep dissatisfaction. I suppose we can chalk a little of it up to her being so flabbergasted at the ridiculousness of his assertions, but still. I really hope it will be addressed again soon.
Sorry for leaving such a negative comment. I'm really enjoying this story so far! Looking forward to more installments. =D
Hmm. This has to be the first time I heard someone interpret Equestrian society with the pegasi, rather than the unicorns, on top. Interesting.
Other than that, Velar's interpretation is... well, unconvincing. In some ways, it's tempting to say he got it backwards. The "easiest jobs making weather and things" seem to be mostly low-level drudge work -- the equivalent to blue-collar jobs in our society, honestly -- whereas you have plenty of earth ponies in the social and political elite, and they especially seem to dominate the economic elite. I have a rather difficult time seeing the likes of Hoity Toity, Photo Finish, Sapphire Shores, Sheriff Silverstar, Mayor Mare, Gladmane or Filthy Rich and his family as the social equivalent of slaves.
Not that this is terribly surprising, though. From what we've seen so far, the griffons don't appear to have a terribly accurate or in-depth understanding of how Equestria works (not that the ponies seem to have much knowledge in the way of how griffon society works, either, on their end of things). Velar is basing his conclusions on very fragmentary and superficial data, which he is assuming to be a lot more complete and reliable than it really is.
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Heh, Filthy joining the embassy would be hilarious. Going on the description of the griffon social classes, he would probably be closer to being one of the wealthy and powerful citizens than anything.
Velar's reaction would be priceless, especially since the way Filthy's family moved up in the world would make a nice pointed counterpoint to Velar's assertion that "[their] slaves are trapped by their living expenses and their cutie marks".
Actually, now that I think about it... with the way the new griffon lands are generally south of Equestria proper and mostly desertic, they would probably be fairly close to the general desert area in Equestria's south where Appleloosa and Dodge Junction and suchlike towns are, yes? Because in that case, the first authority figures the griffon workers would meet on heading out would be sheriffs like Sheriff Silverstar and business owners like Cherry Jubilee -- earth ponies.
There is no way there isn't war. It's inevitable given the economic and political forces at work
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Doesn't surprise me much. Griffons in this story view themselves as the inherent betters of basically everyone else, so of course the pony race most similar to them will be seen as the closest second place. Velar's really just coming up with rationalization for that one angle.
Why does everyone assume Pegasi have easy lives?! They have to control the weather and in this story the climate, do you know how much that's going to affect animals and other climates? Another team is going to have to fix climates somewhere else, not to mention they have to make sure a right amount of everything gets everywhere that's going to cause a majority of problems.
Pegasi have it the worst!
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Not really. It's like having a whole body. Like trying to get through an entire dnd campaign simply with a dex stat.
You can't simply dismiss one group of ponies because of another.
Why was it never mentioned before now that the murder turkeys did not keep Ponies as slaves or at least not many? I still think this is a bad idea and why the fuck does Starlight have a crush on the not-prince? Where is the common ground? Where is the foundation? How did this form? There was no indication for it whatsoever. It feels badly forced wnd without reason.