*breaks stuff* · 8:30am Aug 26th, 2014
My iPad, to be exact.
That's right, I dropped my iPad. It still works perfectly, actually - it's just the screen that's broken. It's not even that obtrusive; it's mostly concentrated on the corners.
It's fucking irritating, though. Need to get this shit fixed. >.<
In other news, I'm starting to plan a series of stories (maybe a whately academy/SCP style thing where authors just plug their stories in?) wherein everybody on Earth has been in a week-long time loop for the past three centuries. Lots of stuff to consider, and I'm torn between starting with a romance (so that the world's 'culture' and its societal system is shown, as well as the manner by which people trade and give gifts/show affection) and a horror story (wherein a man keeps on repeating his final moments, not knowing why this is happening, if he's in the afterlife, or what). To make things clear, this isn't an MLP idea. It's original fiction stuff.
Another thing of note is that I've made a habit of drinking lotsa coffee. Three cups a day - small cups, and just instant coffee - but three cups spread throughout the day nonetheless.
Also, I've got to write an essay about Facault and some less notable (in my eyes, anyway) people who talk about images in society. Five pages. Won't be too long. Hopefully.
Of course, that's worsened by the need to prepare for a math test tomorrow. And the need to read a boring book called "The Gangster of Love". It's not actually THAT bad, but realist stories generally fail to capture my attention unless they're short.
EDIT: FUCK! Forgot to plug in this awesome thing!
So here's Twysalis. I've been writing some awesome stuff. Actually, being the narcissistic shit that I am, I think I'd best direct you guys to a story I wrote. Here.
Read that story (it's a quick read - less than a thousand words), then put yourself in this situation: Your name is Celestia. You have to decide whether to give Chrysalis and her changelings - beings who have admitted (in a desperate gambit to make you trust her) to unconsciously manipulate emotions so that the maximum amount of positive emotions towards them are reached at all times - legal status in Equestria, or keep them out. There might be a middle ground, but you're under pressure from two sides, and at the moment you can't think of any.
What do, assuming there's no middle ground?
What do, assuming there IS?
Sorry about the iPad.
I don't seem to be thinking of much to say on the time loop thing.
Good luck with your assignments!
Regarding your Twysalis story:
This is a rather interesting situation for me, as I seem to be, once again, approaching the situation from a perspective very different from yours. I was rather shocked at the Princesses in your story having a negative reaction to the revelation, for instance. I assume that this stems from your extremely high valuation of individual free will?
In that situation, I think that I'd worry that they were lying about this, having bet that I'd consider it a good reason to let them in. It therefore would do nothing to build trust, and something else would be needed for that.
…Actually, I'm not sure how it builds trust in your situation. What strategic or tactical advantages against the changelings does possessing the information give Equestria?
2402948 Not strategic, but the fact that changelings influence ponies involuntarily (unconsciously) and (I think I stated, but it's two in the morning) at all times is a good reason as to why ponies would want changelings to NOT live in Equestria. Celestia and Luna (the latter's loathing being aimed at Chryssi's species rather than her specifically, though the former informs the latter) may trust this specific changeling, but their willingness to let changelings live among their populace has almost certainly fallen straight through the ground.
Beings that fuck with free-will, even unwillingly, don't sound like the best things to have living in your kingdom. In one sense, my question was whether denying them refuge was more or less moral than giving them refuge amongst potentially vulnerable civilians .
What I was thinking that Chrysalis was thinking was basically this:
There would be no (SELFISH (well, there is, but I'm talking in a relatively immediate sense) reason for Chrysalis to say that she and her species unconsciously manipulated emotions; there are some 'better' ways to induce trust, assuming she's telling the truth, and if she's lying she's giving ponies not only an incorrect opinion as to what Changelings are like, but a worse one than they'd have if they knew the reality (unless the reality is worse - in which case, they may as well make their image less terrible than it already is rather than more).
Therefore, Chrysalis' reason for revealing this fact wasn't selfish (at least, not immediately selfish. It could be ultimately selfish, in a way, but... Blegh, I'll try elaborating on this part tomorrow, assuming it still makes sense to me). Assuming she's telling the truth (and again, no reason to not tell the truth about this), this also means that Chrysalis is voluntarily giving up an advantage of theirs (perhaps not one in terms of strategy, but so long as ponies don't know about this they don't have any immediate reason to worry about changelings living amongst the populace, and changelings can thus feed on ponies in Equestria), deliberately putting her species at a disadvantage to the ponies.
But by doing so, she's also deliberately and openly placing her trust in the princesses. She's saying 'we're desperate enough that we'll give you all of our tactical advantages if you let us live with you', and she's, in a sense, guilt-tripping Celestia. Which might seem bad, in a sense, but it makes sense considering what's at stake (Chrysalis' entire swarm). As Twilight said, she's already picked 'ally' in the prisoner's dilemma, and the princesses know this. She has much less risk than she did before, now that the changelings have given up their advantage, and there's no selfish (and by selfish I mean pertaining to the safety of her subjects, I think. Might be making a mistake, I'm drowsy) reason to not drive changelings out.
Celestia's choices have now become 'risk her little ponies' free will, but provide refuge and food to changelings who are clearly desperate and possibly close to dying' and 'keep changelings out, and protect her little ponies, betraying all of this trust that's been forced upon me in the process'.
Chrysalis is basically forcing Celestia's decision, and playing on her morality (which isn't to say that Chrysalis is being evil in any way). She's forcing Celestia to choose between two morally ambiguous choices, and trying to bias Celestia towards the one more favorable to Chryssi by what she believes to be Celestia's belief that loyalty should be rewarded.
Does any of this make sense?
2403079
Ah, okay, I think I see your point of view. I think that the most interesting part of this for me may still be how radically different it is from mine, though. I see this ability as a benefit, a reason to bring them in, not as a threat that has to be weighed against mercy. The question for me isn't "Is this an acceptable risk for not committing genocide through inaction?", it's "This seems too good to be true; is it?"
Hm. Thinking about it, unless they could provide some other evidence, I might be a bit more inclined to take them in if they didn't tell me this. I already think that, given the information I have, they could probably be trusted, and, given how useful they could be, there's not much of a reason to not let them in. If they add this in, though… well, like I said above: it starts seeming too good to be true, which, given the changelings' reputation for deception, is concerning.
2403121 There might be many levels of deception - some of which could be imaginary on Celestia's part. Then again, Chrysalis' reaction does seem a bit exaggerated, doesn't it?
But on the surface level (by which I mean the level on which I actually considered what Chryssi would do), Chrysalis is taking a huge risk, and is placing all of her trust in Celestia's han-er, hooves.
And the way I see it, if Chrysalis was later revealed to have been manipulating emotions and KNEW that she'd been manipulating emotions, that would be quite a violation of trust - one that could potentially get her kicked out. In a sense, it's best that she gets it out of the way early.
Actually, what is the information you have that makes you trust them more in the scenario wherein changelings don't tell you this extra fact? I just want to make sure we're not talking around each other.
Just in case I hadn't communicated myself properly (in which case, I really need to edit that submission), changelings subconsciously manipulate feelings such that ponies have positive feelings towards them without these influences being noticeable. This means some obvious things like ponies being happier than they might have been around the changeling on one hand, but on another it also means that some ponies become biased towards things they wouldn't normally be biased towards - which is a violation of free will. In addition, in order to maximize feelings towards one changeling, it's entirely possible that feelings towards others could be lessened - a hint of perceived betrayal in a pony's relationship with her stallionfriend can lead to a desire to trust the changeling just a little bit more, for example.
2403141
"Actually, what is the information you have that makes you trust them more in the scenario wherein changelings don't tell you this extra fact? I just want to make sure we're not talking around each other."
It's that I'd probably already be letting them in; there's no reason for them to add this extra incentive before the deal is signed. If they do so, sure, maybe it's just because they were desperate, misjudged me, and are throwing in everything they can, but maybe it's because they're lying about it and have some ulterior motive. The asking of the question is a slight reduction of trust. If Chrysalis had revealed it just after the agreement was signed, no problem. If Chrysalis didn't reveal it at all and it was discovered years down the line, well, that might be a bit tricky to manage, but I think that it could still relatively easily be handled well.
The emotion manipulation sounds like about what I was thinking of, yes. I can see that there could be a few problems getting everything worked out, but I still think that it would be a net benefit (by itself, not even considering all of the other things changelings can do for the country) to the people and government.
2403202 Huh. An interesting viewpoint.
(STREAM OF CONSCIOUSNESS, SOME STUFF MIGHT COMPLETELY DIGRESS FROM MY POINT)
While Celestia is ultimately thinking of her country, there are many other factors she has to consider.
Cadance has many bad memories of changelings, for example. If Celestia were to allow changelings into Equestria, she has to find a way to stay in good graces with Cadance - who, it should be noted, will soon rule the Crystal Empire (though this can only be factored assuming Celestia has prior knowledge of this). She probably wants to stay in good graces with the princess of another kingdom.
And ponies still view changelings as monsters (not actively, as they might if Chrysalis decided to attack instead, but there's still a negative perception of them). There's no easy solution to this the way there was with Luna/Moon, since 'good' changelings and 'bad' changelings are still the same beings. Ponies (and I'm assuming that ponyville's residents are largely representative of Equestria's residents as a whole, though this likely isn't completely accurate) have shown themselves to not be good with other species (Gilda is driven out of Ponyville by the resident party pony in a malicious manner and the other ponyvillians have basically no qualms with this - even when it's been clear that Gilda's being deliberately alienated; Zecora is distrusted by basically everypony in town; Spike is basically a glorified slave - a slave that Twilight might even love as a brother, but an inferior being nonetheless, etc.), and if Celestia decides to have changelings move in, who knows what panic might ensue?
Unless she doesn't tell anypony. Which could work, but that's quite a breach in trust.
And then, of course, there's the fact that Chrysalis could be deceiving the princesses, or attempting to do so. There's already reason to suspect that changelings are being deceitful based on prior interactions. The gambit with revealing unconscious emotion manipulation was an attempt to quell those fear; by showing at least one card in her hand, Chrysalis has weakened herself against Equestria for the sole purpose of making the princesses trust her intentions.
I find it interesting that you'd let changelings in without that information (I sure as shit wouldn't). It's strange, how differently we interpret the same information. Where I see risk, you see incentive. Where I see distrust, you see potential for greatness. Where I see sacrifice and an attempt to gain trust, you see the possibility of deceit.
It should be noted for a moment that Luna explicitly asked for something to prove that she could be trusted - this sentiment wasn't necessarily shared with Celestia, but Chrysalis figured that providing one of her species' advantages as a collateral (not quite the correct usage of the word, I know, but I neither own a dictionary nor wish to search google) could work. So that makes it seem slightly less likely that there's an ulterior motive based on your reasoning (there's a valid reason as to why Chrysalis would believe that she should provide an extra incentive).
2405135
"Huh. An interesting viewpoint."
Ah, it appears that I was the one not making myself clear; sorry about that.
Cadance is a potential issue, yes. While my impression is that the Crystal Empire is at least a vassal of Equestria, Celestia would still want to maintain good relations. With both Celestia and Cadance having plenty of time to repair their relationship, though, and the changelings on the brink of death…
Celestia could just try to keep a lid on this. The changelings will probably have a much easier time disguising themselves if the government is backing them up instead of hunting them. Eventually, it could be revealed, either after people have gotten to know that the disguised changelings are good or when there's some big disaster that the changelings can save people from. Cadance might be even more of an issue with that, though. Make up something about Twilight reforming them, maybe? Not as good but less likely to lead to Cadance causing a problem. Oh, particularly if she's fooled as well! …But that might really cause problems with her down the road, so… hm. Well, it probably depends on the details, and Celestia has options.
Ah, and I see that you already suggested a coverup.
There is indeed a chance of deception, but then, there are also scenarios in which it would, looking back, be good to take them in even if they were planning something. It's possible that they might discover that they cover is actually working better than what it was covering.
"I find it interesting that you'd let changelings in without that information (I sure as shit wouldn't). It's strange, how differently we interpret the same information. Where I see risk, you see incentive. Where I see distrust, you see potential for greatness. Where I see sacrifice and an attempt to gain trust, you see the possibility of deceit."
I know! I'm pretty sure that it all goes back to our differing valuations of autonomy, of course. I'm not sure that I even count this as a violation of free will; if I do, it's certainly not enough to outweigh the contribution it would make to general harmony. To you, on the other hoof, the exact same thing is a violation of free will so great that, even with the extinction of a sentient species begging for aid on the other side of the scale, it's still a difficult choice.
I'm reminded again of the debates about the my changelings in that game. The nature of their hiveminds is a bit tricky to explain, but the characteristic of interest here is that those changelings who had enough identity to be considered individuals basically couldn't want to act against what they believed to be the interests of the Hive. I and the other pro-changeling player got this immediately and liked it; I don't consider it a violation of free will at all, acting, as it were, on a stage of the process of decisionmaking upstream of free will's input. One of, at least, the anti-changeling players had difficulty grasping it and considered it a terrible violation of free will once they had.
Regarding Luna asking, good point, though there is of course the matter that to you it (or, rather, its revelation) is a reason for trust but a disincentive while to me it has a neutral impact on trust (and its revelation has, if anything, a negative one) but is an incentive. From my point of view, therefore, it's actually even worse; not only is Chrysalis volunteering that information, she's volunteering it instead of something Luna asked for.
It sounds, though, like this Chrysalis is on the best track to try and convince your Princesses; I suspect that she might be using a different strategy if her preliminary research had discovered that they were using my value system instead of yours.