One thing I noticed is that the fandom never carried a real grudge against Sunset despite her actions, which is very different from the fandom treatment of Starlight. I think it has to do with the scene where Sunset was sobbing in a hole in the ground, begging to be forgiven. It's a little hard to stay mad at that. Add the fact that she's in the form of a human teenager who still has distinct juvenile characteristics and it becomes basically impossible not to want to hug her.

That and she really suffered to earn her forgiveness from her peers.

7329651
Just putting it out there, Starlight had a different type of redemption considering the fact that unlike Sunset she didn't get a rainbow nuked into the ground. Starlight had to watch as her entire philosophy was torn apart in front of her and had to come to the conclusion herself that she was in the wrong.

Not trying to say one is better than the other, just pointing out the key differences.

7329651
I’m gonna claim relevance.

She was reformed at the end of the movie after the whole adventure like a lot of villains are and carried her basic take over the world goal.

Starlight was in the main show and you knew she was around in a ton of episodes after she was beaten and nearly destroyed time. She was a risky new move for the show to keep things fresh, a welcome one in my opinion. :3

So it just stands to “New character who we’re not even sure is canon” vs “new character who spices you the flow of everything with bigger events”

Arguably at least.

Meanwhile Starlight got everything handed to her on a silver platter and everyone just treated her like Jesus while Sunset had to freaking EARN her forgiveness

7329661
Yeah, Sunset had to suffer through a whole bunch of 'No offence' gags (Rainbow Rocks) , a comic that shall never be spoken of again, and a full on reset of her redemption arc (Forgotten Friendship)

Starlight's thing was so sudden IMO

Honestly... I just stopped caring about the pony side of gen 4 after the human world showed up....

7329661
This. While I like both characters and they're among my favs, Sunset had a whole movie to undergo a redemption arc where we saw her finding her place in the group, questioning if she belongs in it, dealing with the hate and spite of those she hurt, working to overcome her past flaws, and helping the heroes fight a villain. One could even argue that her redemption arc continued into Friendship Games, where she gained an understanding of the magic of friendship she lacked before and stepped up as the new leader of the group.

Starlight never had a redemption arc, she had a song montage, and then Season 6 she's nice now and friends with the group and Twilight's roommate. She grew into a fine character in her own right and I really like her, but her redemption "arc" is practically non-existent, and the times we'd eventually get her facing her past and overcoming her flaws still can't compare to what Sunset got.

7329667
I WILL be the first to say I enjoy a good Sunset Torture porn when done RIGHT. The Comic, and Forgotten Friendship were terribly done. There are plenty of good "S.T.P."'s on here. and FUCK the "No Offense" crap. That shit there makes good fan fics on here all the better.

But yeah. Starlight just feels like a Mary Sue in the end. Even her backstory is more of her just being a whinny brat that her friend got his cutie mark before her.

I forgave her because she was truly misunderstood and was a teenager. After getting blasted, we see her try to fix things, and thats wonderful. Sunset is a likable and relatable character, especially to those in high school.
Starlight wasn't really looked that way because of her actions and how she never got a magic rainbos lazer of death! to the face. She continued to fuck over othets and fuck up herself. The final straw ended in the canonically of the entire mlp fandom's fics through time travel.

7329674
shit I cant even remember Starlight "facing" her past outside of going back to the village she brainwashed and freaked out cause they wanted her back in charge. Boo Hoo.
I do think Starlight grew into a fine character, but at times... I still feel shes a Mary Sue with moments like blasting Discord's body off of school property, swapping Celestia and Luna's Cutie Marks, and able to battle a super charged Chrysalis on her own and pretty much still be on level with her. And the fact she had no actual redemption arc just sadly seals her fate for me.
I might be abit biast with Sunset as she is my fav character in all of fiction, but the thing is, shes an actual character. Shes got things shes good and bad at, and still has plenty of flaws, but thats what makes her "human"(or pony. whichever world shes in). Starlight, in my eyes, can do no wrong, has no flaws outside of maybe dealing with Trixie(to be fair, she can be hard to deal with sometimes) and, as said, had no redemption. She might as well of blasted all of Equestria with a mind beam saying "You will love me and everything I do and will pretend I never done nothing wrong and never do that 'No Offense' crap you did with Sunset! K? Thanks!"

7329651
Sunset actually earned her redemption, in my opinion, and then spent time fearing she'd backslide into her old ways. This makes her a very compelling character, and arguably the strongest character EqG created.

Starlight, on the other hand, was forgiven more or less instantly by everycreature and automatically gained their trust, whereas Sunset had to earn it. We also never saw Starlight face the consequences of her actions (endlessly stating what she did wrong doesn't count in my opinion).

I think Sunset's story is a little bit more interesting than most in the show. At the end of her Redemption Arc it went back and righted a wrong that was never supposed to be. Like Twilight she was a student with a lot of potential taught by Celestia, it's just their personalities were on the opposite ends of the spectrum. While Twilight was antisocial and self-conscious Sunset was ambitious and overly confident. But at the end of the day both of them needed to find friends to find their true potential. Twilight ascended and became an alicorn but you could say that Sunset still earned her wings.

7329681
I can see the argument for Starlight being a Mary Sue, but I respectfully disagree. She has several major flaws that cause her problems repeatedly - her short temper and social anxiety that cause her to make drastic snap decisions, her self-satisfaction in her own ideas and plans even if she hasn't fully thought them through, and her over-reliance on magic to solve any problem even if a magical solution isn't the best way. Every Little Thing She Does and All Bottled Up especially showcase how very flawed she is. And she spent the second half of A Royal Problem second-guessing if her hasty decision was the right call and trying to do damage control by helping Luna through her unfamiliar day instead of just tagging along.

7329692
hmm someday Ill have to remarathon the show to see these cause I dont remember everything. Though I do say with A Royal Problem, Id say that was more Twilight freaking her out constantly throughout the episode.

7329697
To an extent, but even immediately after Starlight cast the spell, she was visibly afraid of what Luna and Celestia might do to her and not 100% confident she had done the right thing.

7329651
It also has to do with the fact that most viewers are familiar with their history, and have seen what totalitarian ideologies and Cults can do in our history books. Most of us can simply feel that Starlight's crimes are too close to home, and we know in horrid detail the consequences fo them in real life. So in the end it has to do with severity. Yes, Sunset did turn into a demon, but objectively she was a vicious bully in a high school and did some hundred of thousands of dollars worth of property damage. No one died as far as we know and if anyone committed suicide because of Sunset's bullying we don't know either.

Also, Starlight did not get a whole movie's worth of a redemption plot. And honestly, I am more accepting of a grudge against your old teacher over failing you because of your lack of character and crushing your dreams and life purpose as I assume happened to Sunset Shimmer than starting a cult because your childhood crush moved because his parents wanted to send him to a good school because of his magical potential. It's made worse by the fact that Starlight Glimmer lived a fairly normal childhood and teenage years, and had her father there all along instead of being an orphan as most theorized when she first appeared. Sure her father isn't perfect but he isn't exactly abusive or neglectful as weve seen.

7329712
Yeah, I guess "high school bully" still falls into the "misbehaving child" category which is a little hard to stay mad at especially if she's trying to do better. We know she isn't really a teenager, but she looks and acts like one and she's just so gosh darned earnest with trying to change.

Wait, I'm the only nigga that thought she was being a greedy piece of shit?

7329651
What are you talking about? Before Rainbow Rocks, the fandom hated Sunset. I was one of her few defenders at the time.

7329661
Having to suffer severe mental health issues=having everything handed to her on a silver platter? Really?

7329777
Not as much as Starlight. You didn't really see torture porn of Sunset.

7329784
Actually, I did. Unfortunately.

Yeah, plus unlike Starlight , after being reached out she accepted the first time whereas starlight came back and almost destroyed reality. Either how, Sunset's still my favourite character ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Plus, in friendship games she got a unicorn horn and wings and yet they didnt make her an allicorn which to me, makes no sense.

I feel like Starlight would have been better handled as a redeemed villain if she had been set up as a rival for Twilight early on and then she was driven to villainy and then brought to the good side as a result of her being defeated by Twilight during the whole time crisis thing. Twilight choose to forgive her, take her under her wing as a student but it didn't really have that good of a payoff and i feel like thats the biggest issue people have with Starlight.

Honestly I like Starlight a lot and believe she and sunset would be and actually are very close if not best friends because of their similarities and relationship to Twilight

7329651
I think it was that when we first saw Sunset after her intro, 1) she was actively trying to change her self into a better being, while Starlight was rather passive, 2) Sunset was confronting her past, Starlight was trying to run from it and 3) No gave Sunset their forgivance right off the bat, Sunset had to fight tooth and nail to atone, Starlight... ... ... Do I really have to state the obvious,
And I am someone that doesn't have a problem with Starlight's redemption arc, but in short, we forgave Sunset, because we saw her stuggle

7329783
.... I never once said that she had severe mental health issues. If she did, I never saw them.

Some people were disappointed she didn't die (wishing she'd get the same as Scar, Frollo, or Sykes), but there must have been some major fraction of the fandom who wanted to see her reformed self throughout an episode because Hasbro's original plan was to cast her aside and have her disappear into limbo as if she never existed (Chuck Cunningham Syndrome), but DHX saw how the fans wanted her to return so they convinced Hasbro to let them keep her around.

Good thing too or else the Dazzlings would have won. Was Hasbro really going for a villain victory?

As far as Starlight, she had a tragic backstory (going back to when she was a filly and a friendship ended), unlike Sunset. So that's why Starlight could be reformed without having her evil side blasted out of her. Also, ponies are more forgiving than humans (where they WANT forgiveness of course, if they don't, go visit Chrysalis, Tirek, and Cozy Glow at Maud's cave), Twilight pretty much introduced the concept to the human world and was the first to suggest that they teach Sunset friendship.

7329794
"Yeah, plus unlike Starlight , after being reached out she accepted the first time whereas starlight came back and almost destroyed reality."

That has no relevance to anything. She also never came close to destroying reality.

7329684
Starlight did a lot less damage than Sunset, so of course there were a lot less consequences.

Honestly I think that it mostly has to do with Starlight being a better villain then Sunset And Sunset a more memorable hero I mean starlight In slaved a entire town, Stolen there cutey marks, Kidnapped the main 6, Stolen there cutey marks, And would back in time nearly destroying the future over a grudge. While sunset is generic bully Whose Motivation was She was Mad that Celestia Did not give her what she wanted.

7329651
Well, yeah. If you look at this and can't find it in your heart to give her a second chance you got to be some kind of monster.

7329892
I respectfully disagree. Starlight's plan, had it succeeded, would have irreversably damaged time and space. The most damage Sunset did was a crater outside a school.

I like to imagine the reason Starlight got off the hook easier is because she didn't antagonize the main characters for years on end and break up their friendship behind the scenes (Looking at you miss Shimmer). Sunset terrorized the school long before Twilight came along.

Besides that, Starlight didn't really interact with them for a whole Season up until the very end. By that point, I like to imagine things had cooled down after what is presumably several months and going back to their daily lives. I think they were imprisoned for a day or longer at the longest? As for Twilight forgiving her easily? Well, she did want Starlight to see the light and and hoped she'd learn the true meaning of friendship when Starlight ran off.

7329914
You mean take Twilight to another dimension by screwing with time? For goodness sake, where the hell do people keep getting the demented idea that she was actively damaging the fabric of existence? At worst she was creating new futures that overtook the present. At best she was merely travelling to different timelines.

I mean, it's time travel for goodness sake. She's not ripping apart existence at the seams. It's just changing the future. And if I can be honest, I really don't think she was changing anything in the first place, but that's another argument.

7329939
She intended to rewrite time so that the Mane 6 never met. That sounds pretty catastrophic for Equestria.

7329907
Most of the townsponies joined her willingly, and willingly gave up their cutie marks.

7329914
Sunset tried to kill Twilight and co. Starlight didn't try to kill anypony, and stopped trying to change history when she was shown what would happen.

7329943
That's not damaging the very fabric of reality as you tried saying. We don't even know how bad the next future would be. They ranged from all out wars to Flim and Flam cutting down a forest or two.

7329948
In her defense, she was under the corrupting influence of the crown. She wasn't exactly in a stable set of mind at the time.

7329948
True.

7329950
All of which are pretty bad, in my opinion.

7329884
Did you not see where Starlight decided ah yes lets make multiple timelines where equestria can easily fall into chaos and destruction. If she didnt back down she wouldve destroyed equestria or just made it much, much worse off. Plus yes it does have relevance because starlight declined the main six's first attempt at reformation and did something far worse than her previous crimes.

7329955
One of the reasons I love Sunset's redemption is because she was in her right mind while doing those things. If it was actually just the Element of Magic's influence, then her redemption is a lot less meaningful.

7329974
Well, she pretty clearly was? Before she went demon, she wouldn't even hurt a dog.

7329962
I didn't see multiple timelines, I saw possible futures that Starlight herself prevented from happening when Twilight showed them to her. More damage was caused by her town.

7329995
Because the dog wasn't the real threat to her.

They actually did Sunset's redemption arc perfectly - having her go through at least some period of "consequences" and earning her way back to good graces. Audiences could feel sympathy for her because she struggled along the way to being classified as a "better person", she faced difficulties but she never gave up, and her personality felt genuine all throughout.

Simply put, the writers nailed Sunset's redemption...

...and then they desperately tried to copy that formula again, but would never create another successful redemption story again.

*Nothing against later seasons. I actually love quite a few of the later MLP/Equestria Girls episodes, but they never even came close to the quality of Sunset Shimmer again. All it was after her someone getting their flank spanked lightly, immediately saying they're sorry (sometimes without really analyzing why they were sorry), and then cue hugs. I love forgiveness and comfort stories, but not when its done to every single creature who didn't showcase they deserved it.*

7329651
Also she had to earn her forgiveness from everyone, as evidenced by the reactions she gets in Rainbow Rocks.

7330017 Not necessarily everyone. By the time of Rainbow Rocks the Rainbooms and Twilight have forgiven her, and Flash Sentry is at least on good terms with her. The rest of the school though, she definitely hadn't earned their trust yet.