Hypothesis #2: Humansville · 9:07am Nov 1st, 2016
Previously, I thought that “Ponyville” is actually short for “Earth Pony Village.” However, recent discoveries allow me to produce a much better hypothesis.
There is that common argument that the word “Ponyville” should be absurd for ponies, because “Humansville” would be an absurd name of a town on our Earth, since just about everyone is human.
But now that I have stumbled onto this clue in a blog by devas, I can say that this argument fails:
A town called “Humansville” actually exists.
And here’s a thing: Humansville was named after one James Human, one of the original settlers of the area. Which is a relatively odd name, for a human, but not beyond the realm of plausibility. More importantly, we have precedent for a pony whose name contains the word “Pony” – the infamous Pony Joe!
1. It also says that Granny Smith’s homestead is the first structure in (what is now) Ponyville. Primary canon does not use the word “homestead,” but I have already mentioned previously that this is what it has to be in legal terms.
We also know from Family Appreciation Day that Ponyville was founded because the Apples originally settled there and managed to produce a unique foodstuff that attracted commerce into the area, and we know that the Apples did not, as such, found the town itself. Friendship is Magic #30 also mentions,1 that the original location of the Rich family shop was where Carousel Boutique currently stands, and it has no less grounds to be called the location of the first structure in Ponyville than Sweet Apple Acres does. Since we know for sure that it took months, if not years, for Granny Smith to produce a zap apple crop that actually attracted commerce to the area, Sweet Apple Acres predates the original location of Stinking Rich’s shop – so it follows that Sweet Apple Acres is only marginally within city limits, otherwise that location would not be a contender at all.
2. Notice that in this case, we would have two cases of unicorns passing on the first part of a two-part name – Twilight Velvet / Twilight Sparlke and Pony X / Pony Joe.
Which means that whenever the town was incorporated, or whichever way municipal governments work in Equestria, it could well have not been named by the Apples, and the “Pony” family might have been important enough to name the town after one of them. In which case, the Canterlot unicorn Pony Joe is one of their descendants.2 “Donut” is just his nickname resulting from his primary occupation – running a donut shop.
We don’t have any clues what could have made the Pony family so important, but my guess is, they were politically minded unicorns who originally filed for a municipal charter and/or a Pony was the first mayor of the town.
Well I don't need any more convincing.
Good hypothesis.
I feel special!
Also, reading the wiki article, I just noticed it's part of the Springfield statistical area. Which is all kinds of funny.
Maybe the town itself is trying to become fictional? :-P
4280001
Well, if there's a Smallville somewhere nearby, I would say yes. :)
May I just make the most obvious addition to this:
A town called 'Humanville' would seem a lot less silly in a world in which there's, like, thirty other sapient species. And since Ponyville is on the edge of the Everfree and is in what is effectively wilderness (despite being quite close to the capital[1]) it might make sense to make a big deal out of it being a pony settlement.
Hell, it might even be a pony tradition to name outposts in dangerous places things like 'Ponyhome.' And it would also make for a charming reason in my headcanon why Stalliongrad (Griffon name 'Eisenberg') is called that (except the obvious 'cheap pun' reason).
[1] I keep to a headcanon that says that Canterlot is, effectively, Minas Tirith (especially fitting since Minas Tirith used to be Minas Anor) with the Everfree being basically Osgiliath which fell in that, ah, family dispute a thousand years ago.
4280085
That is a good argument, but here’s a quibble: according to the official maps, Everfree Forest is bordered on every side by pony settlements. Ponyville to the north, Dodge City to the East, Appleloosa to the south, and Los Pegasus and Applewood to the west. I.e. it’s not a frontier, but rather an isolated patch of wilderness.
That would imply at least one recognized sapient species living within Everfree itself, which is not in evidence.
4280088
Damn. Forgot about the map.
Though I guess all of those could be settlements that are younger than Ponyville.
And, no, I don't think there needs to be a sapient species in the Everfree (Steven Magnet's sapient, but he's just one river serpent) for the name to work. The mere existence of other species can put 'Ponyville' and 'Hippopolis' and what-have-you on the menu of city names one might consider and the proximity of wilderness may have made the founders of the place think of suitably pioneering frontierish names.
4280102
This is true in particular of Appleloosa, but not true of any other cardinal direction. And Appleloosa isn’t alone towards the south, there’s the rock farm to the southwest. That rock farm has been there for a really long time.
True. But I still like my version better, because it also explains why the comics like to put Pony Joe into Ponyville, while the series insists on him being a Canterlot resident: He has family back in Ponyville. :)
4280107
Fair enough. :)
The official map annoys me because it just adds the puzzle of why the hell was the plot of land where Ponyville is fallow for so long. Ponyville seems to be thriving so clearly it's fertile and suitable for life, modulo the odd monster attack. How come it was empty for so long?
4280111
I’ll have a much longer, highly detailed blog post about the political structure of Equestria in the works, that I’m putting up when it’s done or when Aporia reaches Conversation 34, whichever comes first. It answers that indirectly.
To put it very short: This particular territory has been under the personal jurisdiction of the Sisters, being part of the original “Kingdom of Equestria,” the pseudo-state that was the suzerain of all the other pony kingdoms before the reformation into modern federal Equestria after Luna’s Banishment. The Sisters selected this territory in part because they did not wish to take the land anybody actually wanted for what was essentially legal fiction and a toy castle. On paper, the place still exists, and the land was not settled, because nobody had the guts to ask the Sisters to live there. Over a thousand years, the forest receded a few kilometers in, but the nominal borders remained in place.
Then the Apples waltzed up and just asked. Celestia facehoofed, transferred it into the jurisdiction of the Kingdom of Canterlot, and put the land up for homesteading. :)
4280111
My headcanonical explanation is that Ponyville exists because Celestia needed a base for the Element-bearers to operate from when Nightmare Moon returned, and the Ponyville we know and love is only the latest in a long string of communities at roughly the same spot. It is very close to the Everfree, though, and presumably the previous towns failed / were abandoned because nopony wanted to live so near a source of wild weather and weird monsters, so Celestia had to restart the place every century or two. (That would explain why it's called "Ponyville", too; Celly ran out of creative names!)
4280102
I suddenly want Vinyl Scratch to hail from Hippopolis.
4280472
But if it sufficiently hip?
4280487
Evidently not, or she may never have left it.
I question this hypothesis!
Or at least, I say this: Would there really be this subtle anti-unicorn "no-magic" winter wrap up tradition if the first mayor/town founder was a unicorn? Seems unlikely. Unless that is, Pony Joe's grandparents were earth ponies, and he's like the first generation unicorn. Actually, it may explain why he had to ride a train down to Ponyville just to get some sprinkles for his donuts, if he were really visiting his grandparents in the Ponyville Retirement home as well or something. Or if secret agents like Con Mane who retire from SMILE can't live in the town they grew up in while maintaining a cover identity. (Unless they are incredibly reckless and in love with their best friend).
4280085 Don't forget the Diamond Dogs! They live right under/around Ponyville, and it looks like they've been living/mining under Canterlot for centuries. I read a fantastic worldbuilding history about how the north/central part of what is now Equestria used to be their territory before ponies drove them out of it, just as the Mild West used to be all Buffalo territory. So yeah, Ponyville could be named such as a way of saying "above ground belongs to us Ponies now, and not to those brutish mutts."
4280116
Well, she had to give them something, otherwise Great-Grandma Apple was going to tell everyone about Celestia flirting with a married stallion! She had to buy their silence.
You're working under the assumption that the founders got to name their town. As far as we know, Equestria has always been under the rule of (benevolent) dictator(s), so maybe it's just the case of Celestia being really bad at coming up with good names.
4281181
Yes, if there were like 3-5 other unicorns in town, and none of them was Twilight Sparkle. If you’re one of the very few magic-users in town, and most you can do with it is lift a coffee cup, would you want to insist on using magic for seasonal change procedures? This would require you to hire specialists from Canterlot and blow most of the town budget on that. You’d get voted out.
That, too, is a possibility.
4281318
Even in a really stringent dictatorship, the dictator is not the source of all initiative. In particular, township names are normally decided on lower levels of administration, which is why so many of them get named after the dictator or his dog.
And since we don’t have a “Celestial City” anywhere, that also suggests this isn’t much of a dictatorship. :)
4281365
Sure, they didn't have the magic to do it then. Heck, they probably don't have the magic/budget to do it now. But that doesn't mean they would declare it a tradition not to use magic when possible......
Unless as you said, the unicorn mayor was one of only a handful of unicorns in a mostly earth pony town, and was cravenly pandering to his constituents by declaring that doing it their way was "nobler." I could see that.
Ehhhhh. Dictatorship is just concentrated power in one individual, not good/bad policy outcomes. Considering we've seen the closest Equestria has to a parliament is an advisory Grand Pony Summit, I feel confident in labeling Equestria a benevolent dictatorship.
4281441
Dictatorship is also pointless flattery offered to the dictator even where they cannot see. This is kind of inevitable. :)
Also “my father is a congresspony,” mind you. The grand summit is pretty special, one way or another, it’s a new project.
4281444
So if Celestia was a dictator there would be statues and busts of her everywhere?
Ohh, I had forgotten all about Buck Withers.
Is it? Twilight organizes one for the first time, but its explicitly stated to be the "largest one yet." So there have been previous ones in previous years. I'd take Buck's statements as proof that it has been around for a while, and before Fancy Pants had the job representing Canterlot Withers Senior had it.
4281497
Especially out of the way. Enlightened dictators frown on seeing their own statues. That doesn’t stop the low-level flattery of the bureaucracy.
I don’t remember nearly enough ass-kissing for a proper dictatorship among the general populace and bureaucracy. Just Twilight’s irrational fear of being imprisoned in a place you’re banished to.¹ As we know from Lesson Zero, Twilight has some profoundly irrational fears about Celestia in general.
While we do see taking Celestia’s name in vain occasionally, the origin of this kind of expletive is the swear – that is, the expression, “X is my witness, I swear…”² – it has religious rather than dictatorial connotations, a deity is always your moral guide, but does not necessarily tell you what exactly to do.
It seems like this to me. At least, I’m pretty sure a “Congress” is a permanent thing – otherwise, it would be impossible for Buck to use this statement as a requirement for him to be treated differently. A summit is over in days.
But, I’ll analyze Princess Spike in detail and get back to you on that, because that summit is indeed indicative.
That said, I think it was you who said that Celestia is “George Washington, founding president for life,” wasn’t it? A president comes with a Congress. :)
4281525
I can't remember if I said that, but it sounds smart and I agree with it, so hopefully you're right. But Stalin answered to the Politburo in theory. If George Washington was still president today, we would probably still have a congress, but how much real actual power would they wield compared to immortal Washington?
Legal, political power is tied in some ways to the social capital of the rulers. I remember seeing Shakespear's Julius Ceasar when I was younger. Caesar didn't seem like a bad guy to me. It wasn't that he was plotting to overthrow the Senate and seize power, he was just so popular and beloved by the populace that they kept trying to force a crown on him, and each attempt he felt more and more conflicted in declining. Brutus murdered Caesar because he watched Caesar's sway over the populace grow every day, and he knew that this populist urging of the masses could only be ignored for so long before the Senate and all the old rules fall away.
4281552
Not a whole lot. But enough for congressmen to think they’re important,¹ and enough for Washington to think that they’re worth listening to on occasion.
There’s a world of difference between written power and power in practice. I know of many constitutions that aren’t worth the paper they’re printed on, I know of many parliaments which are effectively rubber-stamp machines, and right now, I am breaking at least four or five laws – both as an individual and as part of my job – which are either impossible to execute or impossible to enforce. This is nothing new. Equestria could well be a non-malicious example of same, something that Celestia struggles to make work on its own, and fails, still having to do just about everything herself because she’s so damn essential to the survival of the world.
4281558
I think that's exactly it. Though after Celestia saw what happened to Trot (and probably a fair amount of examples throughout history), I'm not sure how invested she is in making it work on its own, trusting mortal ponies to take care of for other mortal ponies. But broadly speaking yeah, I think that's how it functions in practice.
And I love that about your Equestria, Celestia realizes there are ponies with certain cutie marks, and she goes to great lengths to allow them to express their cutie mark. And if letting ponies express their cutie mark has national security implications... well she can always backstop them right?
4281891
…Sudden story idea. It’s a tragicomedy, so I probably won’t write it, but maybe someone else can?…
There’s a revolution in the works. The revolutionary cell wishes to make the constitution matter “again,” even though in practice it never actually did.
After some bumbling adventures and clashing with the Royal Guard, somepony gets hurt, tensions escalate, and together they actually succeed in making a mess of things, drawing in completely unrelated ponies, who start fighting, completely misunderstanding the ideology of the revolutionaries and the reasons the Guard opposes them.
It culminates in Celestia’s throne room, where the leaders of the revolution charge in to assassinate Celestia, followed by the captain of the Royal Guard, and Celestia breaks down and cries, which shocks everypony into silence.
Celestia explains her rationale to them: She really wanted ponies to think for themselves. But somehow, everything keeps coming back to her, everypony hangs on her every word. So she tried to at least make sure all the oddballs are happy too, and one of her numerous projects so that ponies could feel important is a revolutionary cell. You need to put those ponies with a red banner on their cutie mark somewhere, right? They deserve pursuit of happiness like everypony else.
The leader of the revolutionaries and the captain of the Guard make peace, become fast friends and start a real opposition party.
Neat little theory.
My own hypothesis is that Ponyville used to be called Ponysville and is the pony equivalent of calling someplace the People's Town. Over the years, the 'S' just slipped out of usage. It's not unheard of for place names to gradually change over the years. The most extreme example that comes to my mind is the seaside town of Brighthelmstone being shortened to Brighton.
4281982 I get it. And she's crying because one of her little ponies actually got hurt, which ruins the whole thing.
There's a collection of short stories titled "Celestial Bodies." The first one was written back in 2011, and details a cult of Nightmare Moon trying to overthrow Celestia in hilarious fashion.
4280116
Oh hey, imminent.
4281497
The word feels odd applied to ponies.
4281497
Also, if you're paying attention, there are images of her in quite a lot of places.